Splitting Weapons

[OnePotWonder]

I am in fact still procrastinating with regards to the post nerfing the shooter class. In the meantime, here are a couple weapons which I feel have too many gimmicks that I'm dividing into two separate weapons each.


Goo Tuber
Gimmicks: 5 second charge hold, Partial charge storage, Lethal partial charges, Long-range tap shots.

Goo Tuber is the gimmick weapon. It's a heavily nerfed Splat Charger with every single charger gimmick the developers can come up with tacked onto it. Personally, I consider this a waste of a lot of gimmicks, as Goo Tuber is remarkably far from being anything other than a fun joke weapon. As such, I'm taking half of its gimmicks and putting them on a new charger.

Goo Tuber would trade its lethal partial charges and long-range tap shots for a range buff, giving it marginally less range than Splat Charger. Additionally, it would gain a new gimmick; it would charge shots at a reduced rate while holding a charge.

The new charger would have Goo Tuber's range and a 65 frame charge time. The weapon would have long-range tap shots and its partial charge damage would scale from 45 to 130, dealing 100 damage with 45 frames of charge. Its full charge damage would be 180. It would have a typical 1.25 second charge hold, and be able to hold partial charges, similar to Goo Tuber.
I imagine this charger as being short and navy blue with parts reminiscent of a blender, called the ReMix Smoothier (Neo).


Torpedo
Gimmicks: Airborne targeting, Destructibility, Explosive pellets

Torpedo has a surprising amount of gimmicks when you stop to think about it. I was brainstorming ideas for new sub weapons, and figured it wouldn't hurt to put one of Torpedo's gimmicks on a brand new sub weapon; especially with how standalone the gimmick is.

Torpedo would no longer drop explosive pellets when it hits a target in its flight mode. It would instead deal 85 direct damage.

The new sub weapon would be a contact explosive that deals 45 damage with a direct hit and 30 splash damage in a small radius. It would drop twelve explosive pellets within a Suction Bomb's blast radius that detonate after 1.5 seconds, dealing 12 damage apiece to enemies within their blast radii.
I envision the sub as a flip top glass bottle filled with explosive paintballs, called a Messlover Mocktail.


Thanks for reading; if you have any comments feel free to share them.
As always, have a wonderful day.

 

[youre_a_squib_now]

The question I have for gimmicks is do they serve a purpose and could that purpose be done better by something else.

For torpedo, the gimmicks introduce counterplay, and I particularly like that for slower weapons that can't shoot down the torpedo easily, if they stand perfectly still after being hit, none of the 12 damage pellets will hit. That being said though, it doesn't feel particularly necessary, and I'm not opposed to what you did with it (although I do feel like 85 damage is a bit much).

I have some problems with your idea for goo tuber though. Your first weapon is basically splat charger with less range and a longer charge time, without the short range ability that the regular good tuber has. And in return, it can charge shots while swimming? I see no reason to ever use this over splat charger. The gimmicks are there, but they don't really serve a purpose.

Your second weapon is basically the current goo tuber but even closer to squiffer because of the lack of extended charge hold, and it also gets a faster full charge than regular goo tuber. It would be much better than regular goo tuber, but the only possibilities I can see are that it outclasses squiffer or squiffer outclasses it.

So I'll start from what the devs have and figure out what I think needs changing from there. As you listed, it's a 5 second charge hold, that can store partial charges, some of which can kill, and it also has long range tap shots. Ignoring the tap shots, I think it's clear that they're going for a charger that can push forward fighting at close range, or be a very mobile backline. The problem with this is that the long range charge time is so slow that it's hardly worth using, especially if you intend to use the swimming gimmick. As a result, playing the weapon ends up looking like using the short range mode to splat opponents if they approach you, occasionally using the long range mode if there's a backline that's really getting on your nerves, and using the rest of its time spamming tap shots to paint for special. If you watch when goo tuber was being used in the big house, this is basically what they were doing.

But in principle, the gimmicks have a clear purpose (aside from the long range tap shots) and give the weapon a clear and unique identity. So I'm going to add another gimmick to make them all work. When fully charged, it will get two long range shots, much like the snipewriter, except they will both one shot. And it's possible to use one and store the other whole swimming. This makes holding a charge much more useful because you're essentially carrying two charges at once, justifying the long charge time as well. Also, since the entire thing about this weapon is swimming while holding a charge, why is it middleweight? It should be lightweight so it can swim faster. This feels kind of obvious.

Now that the main changes are done, it needs some smaller changes as well. Mainly, it needs to not be a paint bot, since tap shots are still good and full charges now paint double since you get two. The width of the full charge paint will be reduced by 35% and the range of the tap shots will be slightly reduced. Also, to help it backline more effectively, its max range will be slightly increased. And I think that's it, I don't know of anything else it needs. Maybe a slightly faster charge time on the first ring, but only by a few frames if so. It doesn't need to be as fast as squiffer.

 

[OnePotWonder]

The question I have for gimmicks is do they serve a purpose and could that purpose be done better by something else.

For torpedo, the gimmicks introduce counterplay, and I particularly like that for slower weapons that can't shoot down the torpedo easily, if they stand perfectly still after being hit, none of the 12 damage pellets will hit. That being said though, it doesn't feel particularly necessary, and I'm not opposed to what you did with it (although I do feel like 85 damage is a bit much).

I have some problems with your idea for goo tuber though. Your first weapon is basically splat charger with less range and a longer charge time, without the short range ability that the regular good tuber has. And in return, it can charge shots while swimming? I see no reason to ever use this over splat charger. The gimmicks are there, but they don't really serve a purpose.

Your second weapon is basically the current goo tuber but even closer to squiffer because of the lack of extended charge hold, and it also gets a faster full charge than regular goo tuber. It would be much better than regular goo tuber, but the only possibilities I can see are that it outclasses squiffer or squiffer outclasses it.

So I'll start from what the devs have and figure out what I think needs changing from there. As you listed, it's a 5 second charge hold, that can store partial charges, some of which can kill, and it also has long range tap shots. Ignoring the tap shots, I think it's clear that they're going for a charger that can push forward fighting at close range, or be a very mobile backline. The problem with this is that the long range charge time is so slow that it's hardly worth using, especially if you intend to use the swimming gimmick. As a result, playing the weapon ends up looking like using the short range mode to splat opponents if they approach you, occasionally using the long range mode if there's a backline that's really getting on your nerves, and using the rest of its time spamming tap shots to paint for special. If you watch when goo tuber was being used in the big house, this is basically what they were doing.

But in principle, the gimmicks have a clear purpose (aside from the long range tap shots) and give the weapon a clear and unique identity. So I'm going to add another gimmick to make them all work. When fully charged, it will get two long range shots, much like the snipewriter, except they will both one shot. And it's possible to use one and store the other whole swimming. This makes holding a charge much more useful because you're essentially carrying two charges at once, justifying the long charge time as well. Also, since the entire thing about this weapon is swimming while holding a charge, why is it middleweight? It should be lightweight so it can swim faster. This feels kind of obvious.

Now that the main changes are done, it needs some smaller changes as well. Mainly, it needs to not be a paint bot, since tap shots are still good and full charges now paint double since you get two. The width of the full charge paint will be reduced by 35% and the range of the tap shots will be slightly reduced. Also, to help it backline more effectively, its max range will be slightly increased. And I think that's it, I don't know of anything else it needs. Maybe a slightly faster charge time on the first ring, but only by a few frames if so. It doesn't need to be as fast as squiffer.

Believe it or not, I also had that same idea, but I still feel like Goo Tuber shouldn't just be a charger with every possible gimmick.
Really, each of the weapon's gimmicks could be made into a unique charger:

Base Goo Tuber would lose its lethal partials, and long range tap shots, then have its charge time shortened to 55 frames and have its range buffed slightly, making it more like what the developers originally intended.

Another charger could have Goo Tuber's old range and charge time, and long-range tap shots that do 60 damage, making it a unique charger that fights with tap shots rather than charged ones.

Yet another charger could have lethal partial charges and partial charge storage, taking Goo Tuber's current play style and trimming the fat so it can focus entirely on mid-range fighting.

And yet another charger could fire two shots on a full charge, with the ability to hold its charge even after firing the first shot.

This is the reason I want to remove Goo Tuber's gimmicks rather than adding more. Sure, you could give it two shots on a full charge and the ability to charge while swimming, but there's so much potential in its design that it just... consumes. It's a waste.
I really do belong on Team Future, don't I? I'm coming up with hypotheticals that could probably only exist in Splatoon 5.

 

[SAMICOM]

I am in fact still procrastinating with regards to the post nerfing the shooter class. In the meantime, here are a couple weapons which I feel have too many gimmicks that I'm dividing into two separate weapons each.


Goo Tuber
Gimmicks: 5 second charge hold, Partial charge storage, Lethal partial charges, Long-range tap shots.

Goo Tuber is the gimmick weapon. It's a heavily nerfed Splat Charger with every single charger gimmick the developers can come up with tacked onto it. Personally, I consider this a waste of a lot of gimmicks, as Goo Tuber is remarkably far from being anything other than a fun joke weapon. As such, I'm taking half of its gimmicks and putting them on a new charger.

Goo Tuber would trade its lethal partial charges and long-range tap shots for a range buff, giving it marginally less range than Splat Charger. Additionally, it would gain a new gimmick; it would charge shots at a reduced rate while holding a charge.

The new charger would have Goo Tuber's range and a 65 frame charge time. The weapon would have long-range tap shots and its partial charge damage would scale from 45 to 130, dealing 100 damage with 45 frames of charge. Its full charge damage would be 180. It would have a typical 1.25 second charge hold, and be able to hold partial charges, similar to Goo Tuber.
I imagine this charger as being short and navy blue with parts reminiscent of a blender, called the ReMix Smoothier (Neo).


Torpedo
Gimmicks: Airborne targeting, Destructibility, Explosive pellets

Torpedo has a surprising amount of gimmicks when you stop to think about it. I was brainstorming ideas for new sub weapons, and figured it wouldn't hurt to put one of Torpedo's gimmicks on a brand new sub weapon; especially with how standalone the gimmick is.

Torpedo would no longer drop explosive pellets when it hits a target in its flight mode. It would instead deal 85 direct damage.

The new sub weapon would be a contact explosive that deals 45 damage with a direct hit and 30 splash damage in a small radius. It would drop twelve explosive pellets within a Suction Bomb's blast radius that detonate after 1.5 seconds, dealing 12 damage apiece to enemies within their blast radii.
I envision the sub as a flip top glass bottle filled with explosive paintballs, called a Messlover Mocktail.


Thanks for reading; if you have any comments feel free to share them.
As always, have a wonderful day.

I don't like the goo tuber buff you gave, I'd rather just have a range and change speed buff. It more than makes up for the faults of the weapon. I feel that your change doesn't let the goo be more aggro

 

[OnePotWonder]

I don't like the goo tuber buff you gave, I'd rather just have a range and change speed buff. It more than makes up for the faults of the weapon. I feel that your change doesn't let the goo be more aggro

That was kind of the point. The other charger is supposed to play aggro like current Goo, while the original Tuber gets a more mobile backline sort of playstyle.

 

[youre_a_squib_now]

That was kind of the point. The other charger is supposed to play aggro like current Goo, while the original Tuber gets a more mobile backline sort of playstyle.

I have other thoughts regarding this topic, but I just found this funny:
-changes goo tuber to play completely differently
-creates new weapon (named differently) to play like the goo tuber used to

 

[SAMICOM]

I have other thoughts regarding this topic, but I just found this funny:
-changes goo tuber to play completely differently
-creates new weapon (named differently) to play like the goo tuber used to

Maybe do this to the Recycled brella?

 

[OnePotWonder]

Maybe do this to the Recycled brella?

I thought about it, but having a weak shield or tighter shot spread aren't exactly unique enough gimmicks to warrant being made into their own separate weapons. Plus, Recycled Brella is already very similar to Splat Brella; it needs all of its gimmicks in order to stand out.

 

[Algae]

In terms of these special mechanics, I tend to think about how much they affect how the respective item is played.

To me, Goo Tuber has felt like an earth-bound Squiffer with extra steps. The initial way I thought of fixing the charger is to boost its range and charge-speed a tad bit. This effectively makes the weapon a flexible-range charger (with longer charge store). As for splitting Goo Tuber's mechanics, I think long tap-shots would synergize with a special charge-store ability (which includes Goo Tuber resurfacing from the ink faster), whereas a flexible-range charger would probably start from a short range, for more distance between a faster lethal charge level and the long-range (but slower) full charge.

As for Torpedo, its standout mechanic is that its behavior is dependent on how it's thrown. If it touches a surface before it can lock-on, it's a fast, non-lethal Splat Bomb. Otherwise, it's a long-range, airborne player-detecting tool that reliably disrupts those with sluggish weapons. (It also drops paint on your feet and where it locks on; a dash of Burst Bomb).

Now, a new sub weapon that uses pellets to attack can pop into them with only the pellets doing damage, as well as painting a wall if the larger projectile is thrown directly at it. I only feel like it wouldn't serve an interesting gameplay purpose (even in some weird player-versus-environment adventure). I do imagine the bomb homing to an opponent, but I imagine it feeling too much like a faster, displacement-heavy Splat Bomb that makes opponents stay still.

I've felt a similar way about Suction Bomb. It has two trade-offs to separate it from Splat Bomb: sacrificing rolling for sticking to walls, and a longer fuse time for a bigger explosion. Without complex structures to sneak the bomb onto, or the likes of a Tower Control tower to displace people from, the sub weapon isn't enjoyed, to my knowledge — it's telling that the custom kit tier lists I looked over seem to invariably favor Splat Bomb over Suction Bomb. The only solution I can imagine is to slightly intensify these gimmicks.

Lastly, the topic of Recycled Brella. It has two strange similarities to Undercover Brella: it's in the middle of the pack for Brella range, and it forms a compromise between the Splat Brella moving its canopy freely with you and the Tenta Brella attacking while the canopy is constantly unfolded. I don't think making a less defense-oriented brella is a BAD thing, but like your mention of Goo Tuber, it's not hard for some things in the game to be undertuned. ReBrella's canopy is a tad small for a launching-oriented one, and it's twice as frail as Undercover Brella's while it's attached.

I'd argue that Splat Brella, which focuses on keeping a protective shield on you, can be buffed in ways that set it apart from ReBrella (namely canopy ink consumption). And for the whole weapon class, I'm not fond of the canopies' explosion vulnerability or dependence on being launched to withstand more damage.

Something I forgot to say: I heard of the idea of Goo Tuber being turned into a Stringer (I call it Slop Stringer) to mitigate the difficulties of balancing a sniper-type weapon around Goo Tuber's gimmicks, and I'm all for it.