Anyone else Think Splatoon 3's Kits are the Worst in the Series?

Umbreonfan

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Most of them aren't even fun to play and i'll explain.

We have 10 weapons with wall and sprinkler. Specials that barely do anything to affect the game. They give all these weapons utility subs and refuse to buff them. We only have 5 and 6 burst bomb, torpedo weapons. The subs that are actually fun to use.

They refuse to give anymore crab tank weapons after stamper. Crab tank isn't on the same level as sting ray devs. Only about 11 specials out of the 19 are usable, or fun to use.


They make kits like Reeflux deco and explosher that nobody will want to play and are unusable. I'm also kind of tired of them referencing old kits.

It feels like they're too scared to put a lethal bomb with a good special because of splash or something. I hope third kits save this game that's if we even get third kits.
 

OnePotWonder

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To be fair, REEF-LUX Deco is entirely usable. It's not good, but it's usable.
Same can't be said for Custom Explo. F kit.

I feel like Nintendo knew that they were doing with the game's balance, then they became wholly distracted with Side Order, leading to some of their worst design choices like Splattercolor Screen. Frankly, after 100%ing Side Order, I can't blame them as much.

At launch and during the game's first few seasons, changes were good. They were slow, but good. At least, the devs actually made sub and special balance changes. More kits were unique rather than being stitched together or completely ripped from Splatoon 1.

My point overall is that what with the fantastic quality of Side Order; now that it's out, things are guaranteed to get better.
 

vitellary

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i'd honestly say there are not that many kits in the game that are bad enough to warrant the claim that this game is FILLED with bad options. "10 weapons with wall" isn't really a problem; at least 7 of those weapons actually get very good value out of their wall so idk why wall weapons is a bad thing really (big swig, reeflux and explo are the only ones that you can argue are bad wall weapons, i think, and even then you can make an argument for the latter two). less of a favorable argument for sprinkler but there's still a few weapons that get some value out of it (namely the slower weapons like dynamo or heavy splatling), and ignoring the practical value, there's still good synergy with nearly everything it's paired with

it would be nice to have more burst and torpedo weapons but like, "the subs that are actually fun to use" is definitely a subjective thing (hence why i went on the splash wall rant just now lol. it's a fun sub when put on weapons that like it, which it generally is!). same goes for "only about 11 specials are usable or fun to use", i'd personally say a decent few more are at least very fun, and same also goes for saying nobody will want to play the 2nd reeflux and explo kits. yeah no one is picking them competitively but they are fun kits

not to mention i don't think there's even really been that many reference kits lately? there's been 1 pure reference kit in the past 2 seasons (talking abt fresh + chill), plus a few returning subs on weapons that are not really complaining about the subs that they received. frankly i've heard more complaints about them not bringing back kits from previous games that work better than, splashdown

crab and lethal bombs not being on more things is also sad but i'm not sure whether that's directly related to the existing kits being bad, those are separate arguments i think. though i'm also gonna argue that we are getting squiffer with auto zip, which strictly speaking is a lethal bomb with a good special. things aren't really that bad in this regard i think


now all that being said. i'm doing a whole lot of nitpicking for someone who hasn't played the previous games before lol. so i'm curious: were the kits the previous games actually that much better? my impression of splatoon 2 is that the kit balancing wasn't all that great either (i've heard legends of endless shooters getting picked), and my impression of splatoon 1... doesn't really exist outside of knowing a total of like 5 kits from it that people liked, but a lot of the specials in it don't seem that impressive to me. compared to them, the variety that exists in splatoon 3 feels quite remarkable to me, so i wonder what the previous games did better than splatoon 3 has done?
 

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i'd honestly say there are not that many kits in the game that are bad enough to warrant the claim that this game is FILLED with bad options. "10 weapons with wall" isn't really a problem; at least 7 of those weapons actually get very good value out of their wall so idk why wall weapons is a bad thing really (big swig, reeflux and explo are the only ones that you can argue are bad wall weapons, i think, and even then you can make an argument for the latter two). less of a favorable argument for sprinkler but there's still a few weapons that get some value out of it (namely the slower weapons like dynamo or heavy splatling), and ignoring the practical value, there's still good synergy with nearly everything it's paired with

it would be nice to have more burst and torpedo weapons but like, "the subs that are actually fun to use" is definitely a subjective thing (hence why i went on the splash wall rant just now lol. it's a fun sub when put on weapons that like it, which it generally is!). same goes for "only about 11 specials are usable or fun to use", i'd personally say a decent few more are at least very fun, and same also goes for saying nobody will want to play the 2nd reeflux and explo kits. yeah no one is picking them competitively but they are fun kits

not to mention i don't think there's even really been that many reference kits lately? there's been 1 pure reference kit in the past 2 seasons (talking abt fresh + chill), plus a few returning subs on weapons that are not really complaining about the subs that they received. frankly i've heard more complaints about them not bringing back kits from previous games that work better than, splashdown

crab and lethal bombs not being on more things is also sad but i'm not sure whether that's directly related to the existing kits being bad, those are separate arguments i think. though i'm also gonna argue that we are getting squiffer with auto zip, which strictly speaking is a lethal bomb with a good special. things aren't really that bad in this regard i think


now all that being said. i'm doing a whole lot of nitpicking for someone who hasn't played the previous games before lol. so i'm curious: were the kits the previous games actually that much better? my impression of splatoon 2 is that the kit balancing wasn't all that great either (i've heard legends of endless shooters getting picked), and my impression of splatoon 1... doesn't really exist outside of knowing a total of like 5 kits from it that people liked, but a lot of the specials in it don't seem that impressive to me. compared to them, the variety that exists in splatoon 3 feels quite remarkable to me, so i wonder what the previous games did better than splatoon 3 has done?
Splatoon 1 is interesting in that a lot of kits seem weird or outright bad if you just look at them. But a lot of the specials in that game were so incredibly busted that it saves the weapon. And then you have the absolutely busted kits because they gave it that one sub that broke the weapon (Burst Bomb on Slosher, Distruptor on Zimi). A lot of S1 kits just screams "I don't know what I'm doing, but this sounds cool"
In Splatoon 2 it seems that they were still trying to figure things out. But instead of blindly throwing things at a wall, they had actual plans. The goal was to make the game more team-based, so there's more team-based specials, more team-based kits. Some of them worked out, some didn't (I'll never forgive them for what they did to Hydra)
S3 kits in general seem like they know exactly what they want to do. I think nearly all kits have something that works, at least to some extend. It's just that the individual parts are a little weak or undertuned, be it the sub, special or even the main.

And yeah, utility subs ARE fun. You can do some really silly stuff with a sprinkler and sometimes that's more important than getting a splat.
 

missingno

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Well, there are a lot of strong kits in the game. Balance is arguably better than S1 and 2.

But for many players it can be hard to find a good kit that they want to play. In S2 almost every weapon had its second kit by the end of year one, and then it was onto third kits. This time around they've taken two years to trickle out the second kits, and I honestly doubt that third kits will even happen. So if your fave weapon's first kit sucked, you were stuck waiting a frustratingly long time, and if the second kit sucked too, sorry.

The quantity of subs and specials also does mean fewer kit options for each individual sub and special. Gem put it best: "In Splatoon 2, if you liked a special, there was probably a weapon you could play that had it. I don't feel that way in this game, and I don't like that."
 

Umbreonfan

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Well, there are a lot of strong kits in the game. Balance is arguably better than S1 and 2.

But for many players it can be hard to find a good kit that they want to play. In S2 almost every weapon had its second kit by the end of year one, and then it was onto third kits. This time around they've taken two years to trickle out the second kits, and I honestly doubt that third kits will even happen. So if your fave weapon's first kit sucked, you were stuck waiting a frustratingly long time, and if the second kit sucked too, sorry.

The quantity of subs and specials also does mean fewer kit options for each individual sub and special. Gem put it best: "In Splatoon 2, if you liked a special, there was probably a weapon you could play that had it. I don't feel that way in this game, and I don't like that."
Yeah that's exactly why it's hard to find a weapon that you want to play. Want to play Crab tank? Too bad you have to play shooters.
 

Umbreonfan

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i'd honestly say there are not that many kits in the game that are bad enough to warrant the claim that this game is FILLED with bad options. "10 weapons with wall" isn't really a problem; at least 7 of those weapons actually get very good value out of their wall so idk why wall weapons is a bad thing really (big swig, reeflux and explo are the only ones that you can argue are bad wall weapons, i think, and even then you can make an argument for the latter two). less of a favorable argument for sprinkler but there's still a few weapons that get some value out of it (namely the slower weapons like dynamo or heavy splatling), and ignoring the practical value, there's still good synergy with nearly everything it's paired with

it would be nice to have more burst and torpedo weapons but like, "the subs that are actually fun to use" is definitely a subjective thing (hence why i went on the splash wall rant just now lol. it's a fun sub when put on weapons that like it, which it generally is!). same goes for "only about 11 specials are usable or fun to use", i'd personally say a decent few more are at least very fun, and same also goes for saying nobody will want to play the 2nd reeflux and explo kits. yeah no one is picking them competitively but they are fun kits

not to mention i don't think there's even really been that many reference kits lately? there's been 1 pure reference kit in the past 2 seasons (talking abt fresh + chill), plus a few returning subs on weapons that are not really complaining about the subs that they received. frankly i've heard more complaints about them not bringing back kits from previous games that work better than, splashdown

crab and lethal bombs not being on more things is also sad but i'm not sure whether that's directly related to the existing kits being bad, those are separate arguments i think. though i'm also gonna argue that we are getting squiffer with auto zip, which strictly speaking is a lethal bomb with a good special. things aren't really that bad in this regard i think


now all that being said. i'm doing a whole lot of nitpicking for someone who hasn't played the previous games before lol. so i'm curious: were the kits the previous games actually that much better? my impression of splatoon 2 is that the kit balancing wasn't all that great either (i've heard legends of endless shooters getting picked), and my impression of splatoon 1... doesn't really exist outside of knowing a total of like 5 kits from it that people liked, but a lot of the specials in it don't seem that impressive to me. compared to them, the variety that exists in splatoon 3 feels quite remarkable to me, so i wonder what the previous games did better than splatoon 3 has done?
The reference kit thing. I was saying they like to reference the subs. They won't try anything different because they know that sub worked before. Which is why squiffer will forever get auto bomb. For example.
 

vitellary

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The reference kit thing. I was saying they like to reference the subs. They won't try anything different because they know that sub worked before. Which is why squiffer will forever get auto bomb. For example.
that's true but like... people did want autobomb for squiffer, or suction for flingza and nautilus, or curling bomb on splat dualies, and so on. i can see the sentiment about wanting brand new stuff (this season in particular definitely pushes it a bit with 5/8 kits having a reference sub), but i feel like the reference subs have generally been a good thing for the weapons they've been put on at least. why fix what isn't broken, etc, people like getting something that worked well for it in the past
 

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We have 10 weapons with wall and sprinkler. Specials that barely do anything to affect the game. They give all these weapons utility subs and refuse to buff them. We only have 5 and 6 burst bomb, torpedo weapons. The subs that are actually fun to use.
This feels more like a balance problem than a kit problem. As missingno said, weapons generally have good synergy with the subs they're paired with. It's just that no one likes getting sprinkler on their main weapon because bombs are just better in general.

As for the number... yeah I can't think of a good reason for that. It seems kinda silly to have only 6 of some subs but 10 of others. Especially as we start getting to the end of new kits
 

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Splatoon 3 is the most disappointing game in the series for me, but I think me growing up had to do with it. I didn't play nearly as much as 1 and 2, and thus didn't care to look into current kits or hope for future kits. I am not an experienced comp player and again this may have to do with nostalgia, but...

I think why 3's weapon kits, along with other stuff such as stages and music variety, are boring and because they are played too safe. Many aspects of 3 are streamlined, and while I'm not a fan of it, it may have been an attempt to reach a wider audience, which has arguably worked, at least at launch.

I think I much preferred it when the game was a lot more varied and colorful, when the weapon kits used to be more chaotic and unexpected. However, I think this may or may not have been a necessary evil, to have the game more populated and consistent, or balanced and healthy, in the long run.

Also, we may be vocal and passionate about this kind of content, but fortunately or unfortunately, the majority of the player base isn't and I imagine that crowd is the dev team's main focus. There's a reality where we got "better" weapon kit variety instead, only for there to be further complaints about the then lack of balance and synergy that we may have now.
 
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It seems that Splat 3 is designed with a philosophy of everything getting weak kits so that the game is "balanced" and so that "unfun players" can't impose "unfair strategies" on people who are playing "fair."

The problem is too many good kits slipped through the cracks. Some stuff like Splash and Machine somehow got good kits, and other weapons like Shot, Ballpoint, and Cooler stuff got buffed beyond what they were al launch.

Their vision is dead, the "everyone gets a 'balanced' kit" philosophy no longer can apply to Splatoon 3, yet the devs stuck to their guns and continued to keep filling the game with 5/10 weapons as if the handful of 8s and 9s don't invalidate all of them. It really feels like they just couldn't adapt to the difference between their imaginary vision of Splatoon 3 versus what Splatoon 3 actually ended up being.
 

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now all that being said. i'm doing a whole lot of nitpicking for someone who hasn't played the previous games before lol. so i'm curious: were the kits the previous games actually that much better? my impression of splatoon 2 is that the kit balancing wasn't all that great either (i've heard legends of endless shooters getting picked), and my impression of splatoon 1... doesn't really exist outside of knowing a total of like 5 kits from it that people liked, but a lot of the specials in it don't seem that impressive to me. compared to them, the variety that exists in splatoon 3 feels quite remarkable to me, so i wonder what the previous games did better than splatoon 3 has done?
Splaton 1 had a lot of failed experiments at kits, especially among launch weapons. It was chaotic. That being said, very many things in Splat 1 were just powerful. Basically everything in Splat 1 with a few exceptions is faster, stronger, bigger, and overtuned compared to 2 and 3. Quick Respawn and Stealth Jump is the best strategy in the entire series. Damage up fundamentally changed how gear builds worked. Some Specials give you Invincibility without much drawback. Broken kits existed.

Thing is, when everything is busted, nothing is busted. It kinda feels like a Melee or a Marvel vs Capcom in that the game feels balanced simply because everything is too good in its own way such that it balances out.

Splat 2 is much more tame, and many of the broken specials and mechanics were toned down. In addition, there was noticeable care taken to ensure that weapons had the tools they needed to function against other strong weapons, and that someone who played a certain class or style of weapons had options available if they wanted to use a certain sub or special for this rotation, to flex, etc. It made team building interesting. Not all weapons wound up being good, but for the most part you could see where they were going with their choices.

I stopped playing S2 competitively in 2019, so my account of late S2 should be taken with a grain of salt, but TLDR the endgame of Splat 2 saw a lot of bad balance changes that left shooters in too good of a position compared to most other classes. It's kinda important to note the difference between early S2 and late S2 when people make generalizations such that you don't realize they're talking about one while you're thinking about the other.

A lot of people dislike Splat 3's kits because the devs have clearly stopped trying to enable weapons and instead want to limit them. Instead of trying to ensure that YOU have strong, fun options that can take on whatever your opponents can throw at you, the focus seems to have shifted to making sure your OPPONENTS can't throw anything that would require a strong weapon in the first place.

For example; Aerospray is a bad main weapon. It's going to have issues functioning versus normal weapons with decent kits. Splat 2 gave Aerospray a kit with Burst Bomb and Booyah to help remedy this. The Burst Bomb especially helps the Aerospray be relevant in combat when the main weapon can't. Compare this to Splat 3 where the same weapon got Sprinkler and Booyah. Now the assistance to ensure the main weapon can function is gone. It feels terrible to someone who has played Splat 2, and I think it perfectly portrays how most people feel about kits in general going from 2 to 3.

On paper, a game where all weapons have limited kits would be more balanced. If you take like, 85%-90% of Splat 3's weapons, you kinda see a playing field where everything has huge weaknesses and limitations to keep everything at the same low power level. Unfortunately, the 10%-15% of remaining weapons do not have these restrictions, as I noted in the post above, so that on-paper balance simply doesn't exist in reality. What you get instead is a handful of weapons that feel up to par for Splatoon weapons, then a huge list of weapons that just feel week in comparison and are kinda just not not fun to lose with when your opponents are playing the few good ones.
 
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Splaton 1 had a lot of failed experiments at kits, especially among launch weapons. It was chaotic. That being said, very many things in Splat 1 were just powerful. Basically everything in Splat 1 with a few exceptions is faster, stronger, bigger, and overtuned compared to 2 and 3. Quick Respawn and Stealth Jump is the best strategy in the entire series. Damage up fundamentally changed how gear builds worked. Some Specials give you Invincibility without much drawback. Broken kits existed.

Thing is, when everything is busted, nothing is busted. It kinda feels like a Melee or a Marvel vs Capcom in that the game feels balanced simply because everything is too good in its own way such that it balances out.

Splat 2 is much more tame, and many of the broken specials and mechanics were toned down. In addition, there was noticeable care taken to ensure that weapons had the tools they needed to function against other strong weapons, and that someone who played a certain class or style of weapons had options available if they wanted to use a certain sub or special for this rotation, to flex, etc. It made team building interesting. Not all weapons wound up being good, but for the most part you could see where they were going with their choices.

I stopped playing S2 competitively in 2019, so my account of late S2 should be taken with a grain of salt, but TLDR the endgame of Splat 2 saw a lot of bad balance changes that left shooters in too good of a position compared to most other classes. It's kinda important to note the difference between early S2 and late S2 when people make generalizations such that you don't realize they're talking about one while you're thinking about the other.

A lot of people dislike Splat 3's kits because the devs have clearly stopped trying to enable weapons and instead want to limit them. Instead of trying to ensure that YOU have strong, fun options that can take on whatever your opponents can throw at you, the focus seems to have shifted to making sure your OPPONENTS can't throw anything that would require a strong weapon in the first place.

For example; Aerospray is a bad main weapon. It's going to have issues functioning versus normal weapons with decent kits. Splat 2 gave Aerospray a kit with Burst Bomb and Booyah to help remedy this. The Burst Bomb especially helps the Aerospray be relevant in combat when the main weapon can't. Compare this to Splat 3 where the same weapon got Sprinkler and Booyah. Now the assistance to ensure the main weapon can function is gone. It feels terrible to someone who has played Splat 2, and I think it perfectly portrays how most people feel about kits in general going from 2 to 3.

On paper, a game where all weapons have limited kits would be more balanced. If you take like, 85%-90% of Splat 3's weapons, you kinda see a playing field where everything has huge weaknesses and limitations to keep everything at the same low power level. Unfortunately, the 10%-15% of remaining weapons do not have these restrictions, as I noted in the post above, so that on-paper balance simply doesn't exist in reality. What you get instead is a handful of weapons that feel up to par for Splatoon weapons, then a huge list of weapons that just feel week in comparison and are kinda just not not fun to lose with when your opponents are playing the few good ones.
Personally, I feel like Nintendo just struggled to make functioning kits while Side Order was in development rather than intentionally nerfing weapons by giving them weak kits. A lot of "bad" kits have good synergy, just weak parts. Custom Goo Tuber, REEF-LUX Deco, Tri-Stringer, Foil Flingza, Dread Wringer...
The issue holding back at least 60 of your 85-90% of your weapons with huge weaknesses and limitations is game balance, the main culprits usually being Slider, Stamp, Mist, Dart, and Sprinkler.

The kits for Fresh Season '24 are a bit subpar on the synergy front, but I'm giving Nintendo the benefit of the doubt that they put all of their resources into polishing up Side Order for launch, and had a data technician who's never played the video game come up with the weapon kits because nobody else was available.

Besides, if Nintendo really wanted everything to be bad, you'd think that they'd have nerfed Pencil or Cooler by now.

I am aware that I'm on copium, but I'm quite certain that the quality of updates and patches will improve back to around the level of launch Splatoon 3 now that Side Order is released.
 

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Personally, I feel like Nintendo just struggled to make functioning kits while Side Order was in development rather than intentionally nerfing weapons by giving them weak kits. A lot of "bad" kits have good synergy, just weak parts. Custom Goo Tuber, REEF-LUX Deco, Tri-Stringer, Foil Flingza, Dread Wringer...
The issue holding back at least 60 of your 85-90% of your weapons with huge weaknesses and limitations is game balance, the main culprits usually being Slider, Stamp, Mist, Dart, and Sprinkler.

The kits for Fresh Season '24 are a bit subpar on the synergy front, but I'm giving Nintendo the benefit of the doubt that they put all of their resources into polishing up Side Order for launch, and had a data technician who's never played the video game come up with the weapon kits because nobody else was available.

Besides, if Nintendo really wanted everything to be bad, you'd think that they'd have nerfed Pencil or Cooler by now.

I am aware that I'm on copium, but I'm quite certain that the quality of updates and patches will improve back to around the level of launch Splatoon 3 now that Side Order is released.
I don't think that the devs want weapons bad per say, more that they're trying as hard as they can to avoid introducing stuff that's too strong.

I think that the kits have created a feedback loop. Because they kept making limited kits, the water level lowered. Because the water level lowered, they only feel comfortable making limited kits. Those two things keep feeding back to each other. I think a big part of why the Fresh Season kits are so disappointing is because they're the result of this feedback loop.

My copium hope is that the final season might have strong kits because they wanted to wait until ALL options are available to stand up to good kits before releasing them.
 

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I don't think that the devs want weapons bad per say, more that they're trying as hard as they can to avoid introducing stuff that's too strong.

I think that the kits have created a feedback loop. Because they kept making limited kits, the water level lowered. Because the water level lowered, they only feel comfortable making limited kits. Those two things keep feeding back to each other. I think a big part of why the Fresh Season kits are so disappointing is because they're the result of this feedback loop.

My copium hope is that the final season might have strong kits because they wanted to wait until ALL options are available to stand up to good kits before releasing them.
Fair point. Snipewriter didn't become competitively viable overnight, and it was terrible at its launch. In fact, I don't think that anything they've added has been meta on release apart from the infamous launch kits. None of the post-launch specials are above low tier, and three of the four currently meta specials are there because of good buffs.

This is why I so badly want bigger, better balance patches. They're the only thing that actually affects the meta, and making even a single bottom-tier special good would have profound positive consequences. Except Triple Splashdown.

Hopefully we get some decent kits, but I'd rather get a big Wave Breaker buff than one more weapon with Crab Tank.
 

MintyMisc

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The game too many incredible kits for the devs to keep releasing mid to bad kits. I do not understand how with stuff like splash, stamper, machine, vshot, that you get stuff like the nozzlenoses (besides l3d), red pencil, v squiffer, big swig, or literally any weapon with dart or reefslider. And when both kits are bad or not fun, the whole weapon feels like a waste of time to play when you could play an actually good kit, or even just a fun kit.
 

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