Final Smash Presentation Discussion

[Cadet Strongarm]

so? that means they can ignore splatoon everywhere else and avoid expanding it

 

[Zombie Aladdin]

A big reason why the Inklings didn't get in is not because Nintendo is not giving it respect. You have the Splatoon truck, it's now bundled with the Wii U, and there is a major official tournament. The reason the Inklings didn't get in was because it was released too late. Splatoon was not expected to be the success that it is. It was a surprise success. Nobody saw it coming, not even the players. The poll was set up at the beginning of March in 2015, nearly three months before Splatoon came out. Interest in the Inklings did not really come up until the poll has become well underway, so not only did Splatoon come behind out of the gate, but a lot of people who might have voted for the Inklings had already voted for someone else.

Characters like Robin and Greninja, who were from games not yet released when development was occurring, are from time-tested franchises and are safe bets that their games would sell well.

This surprise success is why the Inklings are represented via Mii Fighter costumes: They take a lot less development time than a fully playable character. It's pretty clear the team wanted Splatoon to have some kind of representation, but by the time they found out about how well Splatoon had sold and how many people play online, all of their manpower and money were, at that point, already tied up creating other characters. The Inklings would've been a pain to program and implement, for that matter: You'd need to have the hiding-in-ink mechanic (which can potentially break a Smash Bros. game, especially if infinite wall-scaling were possible) and possibly a wide variety of weapons, sub-weapons, and special weapons (as Final Smashes). While I'm sure it can be done, it takes more time and money, and Sakurai has admitted a few instances of problematic characters being moved to later Smash Bros. games (Villager, King Dedede, Peach).

By the way, every Smash Bros. game has had an unexpectedly big release around the same time the game came out. For Super Smash Bros. (the original one), it was Sin and Punishment (in Japan, at least) and Paper Mario. For Super Smash Bros. Melee, it was Pikmin. For Super Smash Bros. Brawl it was Wii Sports. Splatoon just happens to be the latest victim of "untested and released too far along." I am certain there was no room in the development schedule for something other than Mii Fighter costumes.

I'm just unhappy that Splatoon only got Mii fighter costumes and not at least a stage or even Inklings as DLC. I just find it unfair that Super Mario Maker and Yoshi's Woolly World has a stage and music even though they were released after SSB4. I had high hopes for Inklings and find it unbelievable that there is very little representation in SSB4. I didn't want to wait until SSB5 (there is no conformation that it will even happen). Who knows when it will come out, my best assumption would be 8-10 years from now and Splatoon wouldn't be as popular as it is now.

There IS confirmation, just not direct. There was a mention of "future games to come," referring to upcoming Smash Bros. games. It's why I believe this is the last presentation: They'll be working on Super Smash Bros. 5 now.

Probably not. They think Super Mario Maker's more important despite not being a game. I really hate Nintendo right now.

Super Mario Maker is a big deal. It is 2015's major Super Mario release. It's sold very well in all regions and was heavily promoted. It was also nominated for Game of the Year and Best Family Game at the Video Game Awards, the latter of which it won. Super Mario Maker also has a more active community presently than Splatoon (though the actual number of players at a time I have no idea) and a broader appeal.

All the skilled players gathered for Team Bayonetta while the young inexperienced players chose Team Goku.

Yeah, I'm guessing there were a lot of votes for Kratos, Naruto, SpongeBob, and whatever else the kids had dreamt of who don't know about licensing laws and didn't read the "no 3rd-party characters, please" rule on the ballot. Same for those college dudebros and stoners who didn't pay attention (or don't care).

Holy jumping saints aplenty riding on a candy pink fatboy. I haven't seen this much butthurt since Sega gave Sonic blue eyes.

I had to laugh there. But Sonic's eyes were made green!

PS: I also understand if people picked characters they wanted and they didn't win. I would have been the same way. However you probably would have been me if your number one character was picked as well. There are probably people out there feeling the exact same way as me. I'm just one of those screaming fanboys that just have to share how I feel lol.

Your post was a lot funnier when I saw it was appended by a GIF of a loudly laughing Nui Harime.

 

[Heroine of Squids]

It would have too much Sodium. Marie Can't Control her Salt.

There's no need to call someone salty just because we're angry. That's uncalled for.

they're not very well represented in the west, but they get represented a lot in japan. the japanese splatoon twitter is filled with a bunch of stuff they did with splatoon.

Neither is Fire Emblem, but it's still doing well for some weird reason.

Super Mario Maker is a big deal. It is 2015's major Super Mario release. It's sold very well in all regions and was heavily promoted. It was also nominated for Game of the Year and Best Family Game at the Video Game Awards, the latter of which it won. Super Mario Maker also has a more active community presently than Splatoon (though the actual number of players at a time I have no idea) and a broader appeal.

The game still feels like a sign that Nintendo gave up on making a more anticipated Mario game. What happened to the days when Mario was more creative and wasn't a complete NSMB rehash? How is it still selling well despite how mediocre it's gotten over the years? It's just a lazily made 'game' and there's no need for it to exist.

At this rate, I think Mario should die along with other series that stopped trying like Sonic & Final Fantasy.

 

[YesI'mTaco34]

There's no need to call someone salty just because we're angry. That's uncalled for.

It was a joke about Marie not about anyone here....

 

[Heroine of Squids]

It was a joke about Marie not about anyone here....

Shoot, sorry about that then. >>;

 

[YesI'mTaco34]

Shoot, sorry about that then. >>;

it's fine.

 

[Litagano Motscoud]

Oh my god the salt in this thread is unreal

I'm sorry...maybe it's because I wasn't necessarily hoping for a certain character that strongly, but sheesh. Cloud, Corrin, and Bayonetta look so fun to play. Nintendo doesn't owe anybody Inklings in Smash. I'm not sure why anyone was expecting them. Hoping, sure, but expecting to the point of getting pissed that they're not in? C'mon now.

Also, are we really going to flip out over Fire Emblem: Fates's features? Are we really going there? That's a really sensitive topic. I really don't think we should go there.

 

[Cadet Strongarm]

we have so many sword characters now it's like Soul Calibur and i understand splatoon was a late release but what are they gonna do now? splatoon's hype cannot be any higher than it is now and as time goes by It'll just decrease unless nintendo does something to extend the series and branch out it's exposure

 

[Zombie Aladdin]

The game still feels like a sign that Nintendo gave up on making a more anticipated Mario game. What happened to the days when Mario was more creative and wasn't a complete NSMB rehash? How is it still selling well despite how mediocre it's gotten over the years? It's just a lazily made 'game' and there's no need for it to exist.

At this rate, I think Mario should die along with other series that stopped trying like Sonic & Final Fantasy.

The 2-D platforming Mario games sell much better than their 3-D counterparts (except for Super Mario 64. When New Super Mario Bros. came out, over the first week, it was the fastest-selling Nintendo game in a long time (though I'm sure the public interest in Nintendo via Wii Sports helped). By comparison, Super Mario Sunshine and both Super Mario Galaxy games sold mediocrely in Japan, with Galaxy debuting at 5th. Much of the appeal for the 3-D Mario platformers is in the west.

I don't see Super Mario Maker as a sign of the end of Super Mario platformers, but as the end of the New Super Mario Bros. series. Super Mario is too big of a name for Nintendo to let go. They'll make something really weird and unexpected again. But for now, Super Mario Maker is really big and one of the Wii U's killer apps (the others being Splatoon and Mario Kart 8, and Super Smash Bros. for Wii U to a lesser extent).

As for how it's selling well, you might not like it, but plenty of people do. It has appeal to an extremely wide audience--from little kids to old geezers, from people who have never played a video game before to people who have been gaming their whole lives, and from people of every ethnicity and culture. It has a streamlined, simple, and intuitive structure and encourages mingling, and it taps into the urge of a LOT of people to make their own Super Mario stage, particularly because it covers each major style of 2-D Mario platforming. And unlike the ROM hacks, Super Mario Maker has a huge and public community, plus it'll be randomly chosen for random people to play, so it's superior at getting your courses played.

It's also interesting to watch. Look at the big numbers YouTube videos of Super Mario Maker are getting right now compared to Splatoon. My videos of Super Mario Maker typically beat my Splatoon videos in viewership 2-to-1 or 3-to-1. It's beating out every other game I'm putting up.

 

[Heroine of Squids]

The 2-D platforming Mario games sell much better than their 3-D counterparts (except for Super Mario 64. When New Super Mario Bros. came out, over the first week, it was the fastest-selling Nintendo game in a long time (though I'm sure the public interest in Nintendo via Wii Sports helped). By comparison, Super Mario Sunshine and both Super Mario Galaxy games sold mediocrely in Japan, with Galaxy debuting at 5th. Much of the appeal for the 3-D Mario platformers is in the west.

I don't see Super Mario Maker as a sign of the end of Super Mario platformers, but as the end of the New Super Mario Bros. series. Super Mario is too big of a name for Nintendo to let go. They'll make something really weird and unexpected again. But for now, Super Mario Maker is really big and one of the Wii U's killer apps (the others being Splatoon and Mario Kart 8, and Super Smash Bros. for Wii U to a lesser extent).

As for how it's selling well, you might not like it, but plenty of people do. It has appeal to an extremely wide audience--from little kids to old geezers, from people who have never played a video game before to people who have been gaming their whole lives, and from people of every ethnicity and culture. It has a streamlined, simple, and intuitive structure and encourages mingling, and it taps into the urge of a LOT of people to make their own Super Mario stage, particularly because it covers each major style of 2-D Mario platforming. And unlike the ROM hacks, Super Mario Maker has a huge and public community, plus it'll be randomly chosen for random people to play, so it's superior at getting your courses played.

It's also interesting to watch. Look at the big numbers YouTube videos of Super Mario Maker are getting right now compared to Splatoon. My videos of Super Mario Maker typically beat my Splatoon videos in viewership 2-to-1 or 3-to-1. It's beating out every other game I'm putting up.

So we are getting more bland 2D Mario games in the future then? I can't believe Mario's still doing well despite the gaming industry now only cares about dark & gritty games. I stopped caring about Mario ever since recent entries have gotten terrible to me. Besides, isn't Nintendo taking down videos related to their work, though? Don't see how Super Mario Maker's a success if them taking down videos is an issue.

And it's even beating Nintendo's other series like Pokemon in terms of sales? Wow, Nintendo's situation as a game developer is indeed terrible.

 

[Kowai Yume]

Okay here's my take on the reveals:

Corrin
I was a bit angry about this, but I don't know why. Maybe because he's from a game that has not been released worldwide yet or maybe I have this feeling his frame data is gonna suck big time. Either way, it's just another character I have to deal with.

Cloud
So he's out to the masses, can't wait to see the flowcharts on FG

Bayonetta
HOLY COW! YES! I don't know why I'm excited, I never even played Bayonetta. (Maybe because I heard some of the game's music on that Japanese game show). She looks like she has a lot of potential with her combo game. Don't know about her all around but definitely looks a lot of fun to play.

 

[Zombie Aladdin]

They're not taking down anything that isn't leaked information. They are, however, putting up Content ID matches left and right. It doesn't really affect me much though.

But you know what? All this bitterness is really intense and deep-seated or something, and anything I say about what I like and what other people like about Nintendo's recent releases won't mean anything to anyone feeling salty about no Inklings in Smash Bros. So there's really no point in me going any further.

EDIT: For the record, I am getting every character. Ever since I bored of Melee maining Ness, I decided I'd use every character in every Smash Bros. game I'd get in the future, and so far, I'm enjoying Smash Bros. a lot more in this way. These new characters have weird mechanics and gimmicks though, well beyond the likes of Shulk or Ryu, so they'll probably require practice before I feel confident enough to use them online. (This includes Cloud.) Since I know nothing of Fire Emblem Fates, I am essentially treating Corrin as an original character, just as I do for all Fire Emblem characters, and treating him, gameplay-wise and artistically, as such.

 

[ILikeKirbys]

So, uh, this happened. My hype from this direct has mostly cooled off by now, so here are some thoughts on things that happened:

[WARNING: LONG]

CORRIN CHOOSES TO SMASH!

I'm... sorta... ambivalentish... about Corrin... kinda...

I wasn't hype when I saw Corrin. I thought I was seeing another damn Fire Emblem sword guy. I mean, he's got a cool chainsawswordthingy, but still, not hype about sword guy #10 or whatever the number is now.
But then he turned into a Pokémon dragon-type, and I started coming around to Corrin.

The breakdown after the trailer made me really feel our draconic entrant, since he's quite unlike the other FE protagonists in Sm4sh (still kinda dismayed that he has a counter, but meh; also, not sure if Robin counts as an FE protag, thought that was Chrom & Lucina, with Robin as an important supporting character).

As for coming out before Fates and things regarding that...
Roy did that worldwide (Fates came out this year in Japan, so it's not the case for Fates there... and Roy's game never came out outside Japan, did it?), and he's cool.

To be honest, I dunno if I'll like FEFates (I cooled on Awakening some time ago, and Fates looks an awful lot like Awakening: But, Like, Moar), but I'm a lot more interested in giving it a shot than I was before the trailer (I forgot it existed altogether some time ago, so more-excited-than-I-was isn't a high bar to get over, but still).

And even if that sucks, our new Pokémon FE rep looks to be fun to play in this game.

Regardless of how Fates turns out, this was a good choice, Corrin.

Now for the next Fates DLC, give a campaign that shows how events unfold in FE land after Corrin goes to get Sm4shed.

Now, onto additions I'm not at all ambivalent about.

CLOUD STORMS THE BATTLE!

Never got past disc one of FFVII (got stuck, don't recall where), but I liked what I played, and I thought Cloud was cool, so I was happy about (if a bit confused by, dunno if he's ever been on a Nintendo console before now) Cloud's appearance in Sm4sh.

The breakdown didn't tell me much that I hadn't already guessed (except the name of Finishing Touch, didn't think the whirlything had a name, and its damage output would be disappointing if it didn't have huge knockback), but it was nice to see more Cloud in action.

As for Midgar...
It looks nice. Summon Materia acting like Smash Balls is not something I would've guessed, but it looks like fun.

Genuinely looking forward to picking Cloud and his ridiculous sword up next year.

BAYONETTA GETS WICKED!

SO HYPE
...this right here is why I've only mostly gotten over the hype.

I actually played some of Bayonetta, and the way she moves is really quite accurate to the games (at least from what I saw. Never actually finished them...). She's got the guns, the shooting, the combos, the Wicked Weaves, the butterfly wings, the Witch Time (which is, sigh, yet another f***ing counter move, but at least it looks more interesting than the other ones), and it all looks so damn good.

And she's all combo-y, just like in her games. Which is just awesome.

And her stage is the opening to Bayonetta 1. Which is pretty cool. And if it's gonna have moving floating platforms, that's neat too.

Kirby copying Bayonetta's foot-gun-shooting-special just looks ridiculous. Looks like he grew butt-guns.
That sounds painful

February can't come fast enough.

But in the mean time, I gotta finish both Bayonettas!
Or more realistically, just one of them. Maybe the first, or maybe the second, I dunno.
Thanks for reminding me Sakurai!

Now, onto some maybe notsogreatish things.

INKLINGS GET TO WAIT FOR SMASH 5!

I... don't have a problem with this.

Well, that's not entirely true.

I do wish they'd gotten into Sm4sh. They would've been a neat addition, and I think aybe Inklings would've brought something new to the Smash table, if they got to bring their inking over from Splatoon.
Which they would, if Nintendo's smart, which I assume they are.

But they'd have to have been done pretty quickly if they'd gotten in at this late a stage in the development of Sm4sh, and maybe they would've gotten saddled with some ideas that wouldn't be so great.
And then they'd get stuck with those in future Smashes.
Happened to Ganondorf.
Not that they'd get screwed that much, but still.

Still waiting for him to use that damn sword he keeps looking at... Or at least throw a projectile.

Maybe it's better that Inklings wait a while. Splatoon's popular enough that it'll stick around for a long time (I feel pretty confident in saying that), and a long time's probably long enough for them to get a guaranteed slot in the opening roster of Smash 5. And then they can be developed over a longer period, leading to (hopefully) a better Splatoon representative (and stage!) than we would get if they were thrown into Sm4sh now.
Plus, they might get some cool new things between now and Smash 5, and it'd be a shame if Inklings couldn't bring whatever new toys they got in that time to 5.
Maybe. I dunno.
That's just how I feel.

WONDER RED ISN'T GETTING IN!

I'd be disappointed, but Bayonetta got in so I'm cool.

Still can't help but imagine that he'd have been cool...
But I'd be saying the same about Bayonetta if Red got in, so...

ISAAC ISN'T GETTING IN EITHER!

At least he'll be in Smash Flash 2, if I recall correctly.
I mean, I wish he were in Sm4sh, but he is getting into a Smash game.
Even if it's not an official one.
Still pulling for him for Smash 5 tho.
Maybe as a retro pick or something.
He'll be retro by then, right?
Right?
Doubt Golden Sun 4's gonna happen any time soon.
sigh

PAPER MARIO GETS THROWN IN THE TRASH!

Well, maybe next time, Paper Mario.
I'm honestly a little disappointed that Paper Mario hasn't made it into any Smash games. I liked all the Paper Marios I've played (so, all the ones except Sticker Star).
Just a little, since I can kinda get why (TOO MANY MARIO CHARACTERS/MARIOS), but I'd like to see him go up against his 3D counterpart, at least.
Hopefully he makes it into Smash 5 instead of Dr. Mario.

WOLF GETS SHOT DOWN!

I miss Wolf.

So yeah. Those are my thoughts on the Final Smash presentation. Hopefully that's all of them.
...just saw what you did there, Nintendo.

Gonna call it now; Corrin gets demoted to Pokéball next game if Fates sells poorly.

 

[Nintenm1]

RIP Inklings

 

[Leronne]

we have so many sword characters now it's like Soul Calibur and i understand splatoon was a late release but what are they gonna do now?

14 of 58 total fighters is not a lot. not only that, but only 6 (7 if you count the monado) are legitimately just swordfighters with some elemental power. the rest add something unique to their movepool. link's equipment, pit's various angel weapons, and now corrin's dragon thing. that's not a lot compared to plumbers, magical princesses, PSI wielding kids, a lighting mouse, a thing that throws plant creatures, robots, a little boy wielding a bunch of dangerous tools, and now a freaking witch that can shoot guns from her heels and summon demon limbs with her hair. and so much more.

 

[Smashling79]

I can't wait to play as Bayonetta!!!

 

[warghoul]

First world problems.. Am I right?

The end is not nigh my friends. Let Nintendo keep giving us new maps, gear, and weapons for splatoon. The lack of an inkling in smash it not a harbinger of doom. If splatoon isn't around for the next smash bros its not because people forgot or the lack of support from Nintendo it will be because the game is no longer fun.

 

[Flareth]

My thoughts about the whole thing.

Spoiler: Okay, real talk

*What We Got*
—Corrin: I know jack about Fire Emblem, but I liked what I saw. The lack of shoes is a bit off-putting, but the chainsaw sword and dragon stuff make up for that. I just might get him/her. (And I swear the "FE Bias" only became a thing because of Lucina.)
—Cloud: Again, I know jack, and this time I'm actually not that interested... in the character at least. The Midgar stage looks like it'll kick all sorts of ***, which makes it an insta-buy for me; Cloud's basically an expensive free gift.
—Bayonetta: I honestly didn't think she would get in; what little I know about her suggested to me that she wouldn't be considered on account of being too "racy," I think was the word. Still, a ballot winner's a ballot winner, so I won't complain.

*On the Lack of Inklings*
(Yes, I know, I said my piece & recanted it an hour later.)
Let me say that while the Inklings will have to wait for Smash 5, in no way is that a sign that Nintendo is trying to ingnore or kill off Splatoon as a whole. It just means that, for whatever reason (technical difficulties? lack of time? not enough demand?), the devs decided against including them. That they'd try to bury one of their biggest moneymakers is beyond asinine to me. Especially one that netted them a Best Multiplayer Game award.

*On Sakurai*
First, let me say that I believe Sakurai deserves quite the giant paycheck for his work on Smash 4 (if he hasn't gotten one already). How big it should be, I don't know for sure, but enough that he'll be set for life, never needing to work again.
Speaking of which... I kinda don't want Sakurai to come back for a potential Smash 5. Not because I think he's a washed-up hack that hates my favorite characters*, like most of the salty comments I've read (off-site, mind you). I just think that, well, I read that he wanted this to be the last game, just as he wanted Melee & Brawl to be the last games. I think he oughta take a break, mostly for his health (I had also read that he became ill making the game). I'd hate to have Smash 5 at the expense of his health—it's bad enough that it happened with this game. And I don't think the game itself would suffer without his leadership. It would be a hit no matter who they put in charge.

*I'm not directing this at anyone in particular, but at the mentality that seems to pervade from the stupider side of the hatedom, which I cannot stand. I have my criticisms of the game like anybody else, but if this is the only thing that makes you hate Sakurai... frankly, I find that to be completely ridiculous and overblown. Step back, and if not having what you want outweighs the good things in the game, then I'd advise you to stop playing and find something else. Or wait for Project B to make it a reality

 

[shy]

To be honest I really don't mind the new characters. It's just nice to see some new content being added to the game.

 

[Of Moose & Men]

It may not be a statement many will agree with, but Corrin being released and added to Sm4sh in February is so badass! I was not entirely expecting that to be honest, but when they opened up with it, I damn near popped a blood vessel lol. I know everyone is thinking "Great another FE character" but, this character is ACTUALLY different, and entirely different, not just tipper/hilt/neutral different. Their moveset is 100% original, they have some absolutely amazing animations and moves, they look quick and very well altered to work in Smash. I LOVE the inclusion of Corrin, and I honestly cannot wait for February. I will most certainly be maining Corrin the day they come out. It's going to be a long 2 months.