Getting all content at launch vs Current 'unlock stuff over time' approach

[rodjoh]

Do you like this approach where most of the "new" content in Splatoon was clearly on disc already and its just getting unlocked over time? Or do you think we should just get everything up front and go with it.
I know some people were mad about it at launch and didn't want to pay full price.
Others think it is an odd but effective way to keep the game balanced for everyone as well as "keeping things fresh" with the illusion of getting something new every week.

Clearly the august update is going to be the first "real patch" the game is going to get so.. what yall think?

 

[Cuddlefish]

Third option: Update the game regularly over time, but launch with a full game instead of the bare bones Splatoon was at launch.

 

[ZeroParadox]

See, that's the thing I don't understand.

Unlocking content already on disc by playing the game... that's how all games already work. You don't complain about a platformer not giving you the warp pipe option. Granted, this is an online multiplayer shooter, but timed releases would be the best way of going about that progression in a game where people are going to be leveling/ranking up at different speeds.

I know what people mean when they say they don't like the strategy, but I also don't like some of the words being used. "Hidden content", "illusion", and for some people "not finished"... makes it sound like someone was trying to pull the wool over your eyes.

Still, I like the strategy a lot, I probably would've been burned out and only play this on and off if it wasn't for the small bursts of content unlocking. I'm personally someone who like learning the ins and outs of something, I feel like the way maps and weapons we're released, I had time to do that. It works out for me, especially since most of the weapons are pretty intuitive, so I can spend more time with 'em figuring out their little intricacies.

The August update has me hella excite tho'. @.@

 

[DonkaFjord]

There is some context that should be laid down about how Splatoon was a new IP that the devs didn't know if it would sell or flop. Also shooters have increasingly been having an issue where its user base spikes after launch or DLC updates but dwindles shortly after. Given the amount of Wii U's and the uncertain amount of copies that will be sold that had to make sure the online community would stay active to keep a mostly multiplayer game afloat. I'd even argue Japan's squeamishness with online play with strangers is part of why devs left some of the matchmaking options out till August so people can try battling strangers and learning to communicate or be vigilant about watching the map and seeing how the ink moves to show where people are, etc. It was all a planned ploy to make the game experience better for players- if you play at all hours you will notice some have really slow matchmaking times or you will be thrown with different ranked groups, etc. but they try their best to remedy that with a release plan. I agree this game could have been beefier at launch and I reckon (if they make one) a sequel will fix that, but they should keep the rolling updates.

 

[missingno]

I've heard a lot of uninformed people complain and accuse them of rushing an unfinished game or overcharging for it, including reviewers. Then when it came out that they were on the disc, I heard just as much whining about that too. It seems to me like this approach really hurt the game's reputation.

seriously /r/games is a goddamn cesspool

 

[DonkaFjord]

I've heard a lot of uninformed people complain and accuse them of rushing an unfinished game or overcharging for it, including reviewers. Then when it came out that they were on the disc, I heard just as much whining about that too. It seems to me like this approach really hurt the game's reputation.

seriously /r/games is a goddamn cesspool

I wish people would ask them selves why developers did it instead of immediately sniffling about it. It seems a lot of gamers take gave development for granted and don't understand the time, thought, and money put behind games whether they are well received or not.

 

[RespawningJesus]

I wish people would ask them selves why developers did it instead of immediately sniffling about it. It seems a lot of gamers take gave development for granted and don't understand the time, thought, and money put behind games whether they are well received or not.

This is probably the biggest problem with the gaming community right now. They think that making a game doesn't take that much effort, so they flip out when every little thing happens, since they are ignorant of the game development process.

 

[DonkaFjord]

This is probably the biggest problem with the gaming community right now. They think that making a game doesn't take that much effort, so they flip out when every little thing happens, since they are ignorant of the game development process.

I see so many 'Why don't they just...' like for Mario maker someone was upset the amiibo costumes only worked for the original Mario Bros. theme and that each one didn't have unique moves and physics etc. When people pointed out how much extra work that would take for the 50-some Smash Bros amiibo, the Splatoon amiibo, the Animal Crossing amiibo, the Starfox amiibo, the Chibi-Robo amiibo, etc. People also wonder why Kamiya or the Project C.A.R.S. team get irritated when they are harassed about why Bayo 2 isn't Multiplat, If Bayonetta will be in Smash, or Why Project C.A.R.S. won't come to Wii U anymore. I get that we as consumers should have a voice, but sometimes we forget the limitations these companies have on time and budget and the pressure they have to make money.
Another example is how we clamor for new IPs and ideas but they don't sell well- They are companies after all and money is their bottom line.
I want to go into game development but everytime I reach out to any devs they warn me that the work conditions of the industry are terrible and has a huge employment turn-around because so many leave after being burned.

 

[Cuddlefish]

I see so many 'Why don't they just...' like for Mario maker someone was upset the amiibo costumes only worked for the original Mario Bros. theme and that each one didn't have unique moves and physics etc. When people pointed out how much extra work that would take for the 50-some Smash Bros amiibo, the Splatoon amiibo, the Animal Crossing amiibo, the Starfox amiibo, the Chibi-Robo amiibo, etc. People also wonder why Kojima or the Project C.A.R.S. team get irritated when they are harassed about why Bayo 2 isn't Multiplat, If Bayonetta will be in Smash, or Why Project C.A.R.S. won't come to Wii U anymore. I get that we as consumers should have a voice, but sometimes we forget the limitations these companies have on time and budget and the pressure they have to make money.
Another example is how we clamor for new IPs and ideas but they don't sell well- They are companies after all and money is their bottom line.
I want to go into game development but everytime I reach out to any devs they warn me that the work conditions of the industry are terrible and has a huge employment turn-around because so many leave after being burned.

Project C.A.R.S. is a bad example. So is Bayonetta being in Smash to an extent; it's perfectly fine for people to want her in Smash, people just need to ease up on Kamiya and ask the people that can actually make that decision.

 

[DonkaFjord]

Project C.A.R.S. is a bad example. So is Bayonetta being in Smash to an extent; it's perfectly fine for people to want her in Smash, people just need to ease up on Kamiya and ask the people that can actually make that decision.

True, bad examples especially when Project C.A.R.S. was crowd funded (I think?) and whoops I said Kojima as well. Characters and skin tight suits I guess haha.

 

[Zoot]

I made a thread about this a while ago. I'm still on the fence - in principle I think time-restricting content we've paid for is just wrong, but in practice I've found myself enjoying the ride with everyone. I think I'll only have an answer looking in retrospect, when it's all over.

Unlocking content already on disc by playing the game... that's how all games already work.

Unlocking content by playing and unlocking content just by waiting are pretty different. If I want more stuff I don't have to play more and get better, I just have to sit and stare at the ceiling for a few weeks. That's not a fun game experience. :(

They think that making a game doesn't take that much effort, so they flip out when every little thing happens, since they are ignorant of the game development process.

Oh goodness yes. The amount of crazy Splatoon suggestions has made me realise that most people have no idea what it takes to make a game. The latest one I saw was someone's idea that there should be an Octoling battle arena where you face waves of enemies. That would take pages and pages of concept art to find the look for it, a lot of modelling and texturing work to build the thing (which would need to be reviewed many times by the art director), game designers working out how exactly it should play to be fun, sound designers, music, QA testing, and then most of that process again to improve it. And bear in mind that most of the team would have been stripped out after the game's released, leaving only a skeleton crew to finish what's there and push out updates. Even trivial changes have to go through review and testing before they go in the game.

That's a bit off-topic I know, but this system certainly seems to have people confused about what can and can't be added in future updates.

 

[Litagano Motscoud]

I know what people mean when they say they don't like the strategy, but I also don't like some of the words being used. "Hidden content", "illusion", and for some people "not finished"... makes it sound like someone was trying to pull the wool over your eyes.

This is important. I kinda wish they had this content out on launch, but people making it out to be some kind of ruse by Nintendo are being too dramatic.

Oh goodness yes. The amount of crazy Splatoon suggestions has made me realise that most people have no idea what it takes to make a game. The latest one I saw was someone's idea that there should be an Octoling battle arena where you face waves of enemies. That would take pages and pages of concept art to find the look for it, a lot of modelling and texturing work to build the thing (which would need to be reviewed many times by the art director), game designers working out how exactly it should play to be fun, sound designers, music, QA testing, and then most of that process again to improve it. And bear in mind that most of the team would have been stripped out after the game's released, leaving only a skeleton crew to finish what's there and push out updates. Even trivial changes have to go through review and testing before they go in the game.

I don't see what's wrong with said suggestion. No one said anything about wanting it in a certain time period. I'd love a PvE mode as well. If it takes a long time, so be it.

 

[JarBear]

For the most part I didn't mind Splatoon's approach. It kept you playing. Nintendo was obviously taking "baby steps" with its new IP and exploring something pretty much new for Nintendo. I like the weekly updates of new weapons and maps. The big update coming in August is exciting.

I do understand maybe there was a bit too much lacking for the online feature. They tried keeping it "fresh" by rolling out weapons, maps and changing the maps ... but the limit on playing with your friends was a slight put off. I would like to play against/with my buddies.

I am hoping they re evaluate the voice chat for ONLY the private rooms and squid squads. I agree that during my old days of playing games with voice chat was mostly ... annoying and lots of bashing ... but if it limits to YOUR CHOSEN FRIENDS it isn't a problem. Nintendo said they won't do it, so I don't expect them to include it even if fans beg for it. But again, it should ONLY be implemented for the friends section.

 

[ZeroParadox]

Unlocking content by playing and unlocking content just by waiting are pretty different. If I want more stuff I don't have to play more and get better, I just have to sit and stare at the ceiling for a few weeks. That's not a fun game experience. :(

Which is why I specifically mentioned that this is an online multiplayer game and that a set of timed releases works better than "level as you play" for a large group of people in an attempt to increase the longevity of the game. Now you can say that maybe they weren't confident in this game because of that, but as many people have said, that makes sense, because Nintendo has never done anything like this. Still, I can see how people could disagree with this way of doing things, but at the same time, acting as if Nintendo and the devs didn't tell you how this game was going to work is beyond silly.

 

[Ryuji]

Of course I'd like to have everything on the disc when I buy it, but at the same time it's good to have everything released in increments. Doing this keeps the hype up for the game and doesn't let it get stale. We live in a time where games are becoming increasingly produced with unreleased content and the option to add some more with DLC. Some might see this as being ripped off, but that's really not the issue. An issue arises when games have paid DLC for things in order to progress to complete the game. Splatoon's DLC isn't like this. Everything we've gotten so far is extra and all free of charge. We should all be grateful we're getting this stuff for free instead of complaining that it should have been in the game from the start.

 

[DonkaFjord]

Well there are those people asking for hair styles that aren't just 'wigs' that take your headgear slot, a pants shop, new stores, exploring more of inkopolis,playable octolings, apartments, live plaza with others playing, pets, octoling rush mode, etc. which are all pretty much pipe dreams with only a few being plausible. Different hairstyles (including the octolings' hairstyles) could make sense as headgear, but I don't think they will offer it as true customization just yet- the directors mentioned them wanting the inklings to be recognizable before messing with their general appearance. Pants would be an interesting hassle to code with the added abilities and balance and what not. I think we should all wait for the next game before we see large changes to the general formula taking place. This game definitely feels a little sparse compared to other in-house EAD first party titles but I feel like they were just testing the water. I am sure the next one will blow us away.

 

[Zoot]

I'd love a PvE mode as well. If it takes a long time, so be it.

My point is that it wouldn't just take a long time - it would take a lot of effort, money and team members they don't have anymore. Something like that would be an enormous task and management nightmare. (Same goes for similarly unreasonably-sized suggestions, like a new shop with a host of new gear, apartments, level editor etc.). There's a plan for Splatoon, and we pretty much know what it is. Anything outside of it is too much to ask.

 

[Cuddlefish]

Well there are those people asking for hair styles that aren't just 'wigs' that take your headgear slot, a pants shop, new stores, exploring more of inkopolis,playable octolings, apartments, live plaza with others playing, pets, octoling rush mode, etc. which are all pretty much pipe dreams with only a few being plausible. Different hairstyles (including the octolings' hairstyles) could make sense as headgear, but I don't think they will offer it as true customization just yet- the directors mentioned them wanting the inklings to be recognizable before messing with their general appearance. Pants would be an interesting hassle to code with the added abilities and balance and what not. I think we should all wait for the next game before we see large changes to the general formula taking place. This game definitely feels a little sparse compared to other in-house EAD first party titles but I feel like they were just testing the water. I am sure the next one will blow us away.

On that note, it's less that people should stop making these requests, but that they should shift towards asking them of the sequel. Since it is true that game development takes a lot of time and effort, there is no better time than now to start suggesting new features for the sequel.

 

[Paragon-Yoshi]

Welp, people asking of a lot of things, speaks for the popularity of this game.
People love this game. So of course, they want to see the devs doing more with it.
That as a general stance, should be fine.

But yeah, when you are consumed with hype and are unable to think rationally for the moment, is when you start spouting these ideas.

That being said: Some ideas aren't too bad.
Playable Octolings I can definitely see working in this game.
And NW already showed us, that it doesn't take a lot of effort to do it.
Thanks to the Octolings already having the exact same animations as inklings.
Might need to do a few adjustments here and there, when it comes to gear placement.
But that shouldn't be too troublesome.

But I digress.
I don't mind the way Nintendo is doing things.
All the updates are free. So there is no "Rip-Off".
It's not like they are asking you to pay extra for content that is already on disc.
*cough*Capcom*cough*

 

[missingno]

I'd really love to see a Mann vs. Machine counterpart too, and I know lots of people have thought the same thing. I don't think anyone's acting like that wouldn't be a huge undertaking though, I know it probably won't happen. Just wishful thinking, it's fun to dream stuff up.