Getting the competitive edge out of abilities (info from official strategy guide)

[Deleted Member]

Can main abilities be changed? Or only sub abilities?

 

[Soul Train]

Can main abilities be changed? Or only sub abilities?

Only sub abilities via Spyke. Mains are set in stone.

Also for the record: one main Run Speed Up ability does not increase your speed by 25%, like the video said. It's 12%.

 

[RotomGuy]

Samurai helmet has strength up, Samurai Jacket has Special Charge Up, Samurai Shoes has Special Duration up.
Squid hairclip has Swim speed up, School uniform has Ink recovery up, School Shoes has Ink saver (sub),
Power Mask has Defense up, Power armor has Quick Respawn time, And Power Boots has Ink Saver (Main).
Each piece of amiibo gear has 2 empty slots.

I mean sub ability preferences.

 

[Smashwidget]

so if you have 3 pieces of gear with the same main ability (e.g. bomb range up), do they stack? or does only one main ability count?

 

[Zonderion]

so if you have 3 pieces of gear with the same main ability (e.g. bomb range up), do they stack? or does only one main ability count?

They stack, but with diminishing returns. The first one gives the full amount of the main ability and the other 2 mains will only give half of the main. For example, if the Attack up main gives 12%, then having all 3 main slots with Attack Up would result in

12% + 6% + 6% = 24% total damage increase.

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

I'm looking around the guide atm, but I can't find what I'm looking for. What does it say about ordering gear?

 

[BeanYak]

Damn, the specified clothing items can't change their main perk? I really wish that would change. I don't necessarily care how I look right now, but I might change my mind when I get fully stocked and content with my gear's stats. Oh, also, in your video you mention that you can't increase a weapon's shots to kill. If that's true, what would ever be the purpose of getting a damage up? Is it just supposed to counter defense up? I'm assuming that defense up naturally decreases shots to kill.

 

[Youngster Skaymore]

I wonder if you had all damage up on main and sub abilities if you could kill with one shot of a .92 gal or something like that

 

[Zonderion]

I wonder if you had all damage up on main and sub abilities if you could kill with one shot of a .92 gal or something like that

There's a threshold where the number of shots can never go below the original number. So let's say a gun takes 4 shots to kill, no matter how many Attack Ups you stack, the gun can never kill in 3 shots, or less.

 

[Phobos]

Nice video - thanks!

Abilities stack, but there are diminishing returns
- 1st instance main ability is worth X
- 2nd and 3rd instance of the same main ability are worth X/2 i.e. are each half as powerful as the first ability.

Can you give a page reference for this info on stacking? I have the guide in front of me but can't find it in there.

 

[Casperr]

Nice video - thanks!

Can you give a page reference for this info on stacking? I have the guide in front of me but can't find it in there.

Thanks! And I used the explanation for the Quick Respawn ability. It explains diminishing returns (without using those words). That, coupled with the fact that Judd mentions diminishing returns, is what I used to draw my conclusions. From some studies that other people have done, it seems I may have been too general and certain abilities have different stacking magnitude e.g. Quick Respawn may be 33% for one main and 15.65% for both second and third main (for a total of 66% boost) but Special Charge Up may be 12%, 9%, 9% (not actual figures, just example). I'm trying to work out if there is a blanket formula applied to all stacking, but it is actually looking more like every ability has its own stacking formula... which would be a bit of a headache and counter intuitive if so.

Damn, the specified clothing items can't change their main perk? I really wish that would change. I don't necessarily care how I look right now, but I might change my mind when I get fully stocked and content with my gear's stats. Oh, also, in your video you mention that you can't increase a weapon's shots to kill. If that's true, what would ever be the purpose of getting a damage up? Is it just supposed to counter defense up? I'm assuming that defense up naturally decreases shots to kill.

Yep, that really sucks. I hope they change the system so you can get whatever main perk on whatever clothing item - maybe for loads of coins or something and you get to pick your main. Seems stupid to have a cosmetic system but then lock it with perks. And yes, it's soul purpose is countering people wearing defence boosts. Seems almost pointless if you ask me as they almost exactly cancel each other out. If everyone in the community agrees not to use them then we can continue without them and build classes without.

I'm looking around the guide atm, but I can't find what I'm looking for. What does it say about ordering gear?

What exactly are you looking for? The gist is you can order gear from anyone you see standing around as long as it is not promo or story mode gear. Depending on its * rating it will cost more/less. You can order up to 3 at a time but only 1 gets delivered per day and if you don't buy it that day then Spyke dumps it (what a waste). The sub-abilities get wiped so you have to re-earn them.

It's very likely that subs have diminishing returns. Currently I'm testing this by exact % here, hopefully will have results tonight.

Great thread mate a lot of working going into that, can't wait to see it expand further. One question I have is do you know whether someone can have 3 mains of the same ability and then subs of that ability that stack even further? I'm trying to work out the sums behind Defence Up at the moment. The book says 20% total stack, but the figure I keep getting off the dummies is 12.5% leading me to think that the remaining 7.5% comes from 9 sub abilities at 0.83333% each. Are you able to shed any light on this theory?

Do the sub abilities also have diminishing returns? Great video by the way.

It's a very good question. I haven;t been able to find a firm answer yet and the book doesn't mention it directly. There's a lot of people testing - Soul Train above being a great example. Not sure if there is a firm answer on this yet, but I too am experimenting.

Ahhh this is a super helpful guide. thanks so much for making it.

In the direct, they said that new clothes and abilities would be added. In the guide, it has weapons and stages that haven't been released yet, but I guess new abilities will come in later?

Unfortunately the guide stops at the release day content with only vague references to new maps. It's a real shame because that means there is no stats on any new weapons nor, as you mention, new abilities. I am hoping they release a second edition once they have finished releasing content because there is some seriously good intel in this book

They don't.

Now here's a question: What if I had everything main slot as Ink Saver (Main), and each sub slot Ink Saver (Main) as well. Like, 9 sub slots of Ink Saver and 3 main slots of Ink Saver. Would the modifier be +300% on my tank?

Tis a good question. The book clearly states "up to" on each ability. Ink Saver is up to 60%. It *implies* that this means 3 main abilities and no subs. What it doesn't make clear is what happens if you have 3 main abilities + sub abilities. Myself and others are all independently trying to verify this so watch this space. This wiki article has all the abilities copied out from the book if you are every wondering an ability's max:
http://splatoonwiki.org/wiki/Ability

Does the Amiibo brand have any ability preferences?

Nope. Any brands I left off the chart just have "-" next to them in the book, meaning that there is no ability 5x and no ability 1/2x. Every ability is an equal chance of appearing as a sub

Does resetting the game actually work? I thought the game saves always right before it shows which ability you get to prevent abuse. It does on Spyke's rerolls for sure (too bad they fixed the Judd bug in v1.2 :D ). I think I wouldn't want to risk a crash of my savefile just to edge out all abilities, as I'm pretty happy with what I've got so far.

On another note: Does the rank (1/2/3 stars) of the item effect the power of the abilities in any way?

Not sure about quitting out. I'd imagine there is hidden code that decides the sub abilities as soon as the item is generated on your save file to prevent people closing the game and trying to reroll. As for 1/2/3 stars there is no potency difference. Run speed sub ability on an item with 1* is the same as an item with 3*... Just 3* has 3 sub abilities, basically! If you add more abilities with Spyke they are just as powerful as an item that had 3 to start with

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

Thanks! And I used the explanation for the Quick Respawn ability. It explains diminishing returns (without using those words). That, coupled with the fact that Judd mentions diminishing returns, is what I used to draw my conclusions. From some studies that other people have done, it seems I may have been too general and certain abilities have different stacking magnitude e.g. Quick Respawn may be 33% for one main and 15.65% for both second and third main (for a total of 66% boost) but Special Charge Up may be 12%, 9%, 9% (not actual figures, just example). I'm trying to work out if there is a blanket formula applied to all stacking, but it is actually looking more like every ability has its own stacking formula... which would be a bit of a headache and counter intuitive if so.



Yep, that really sucks. I hope they change the system so you can get whatever main perk on whatever clothing item - maybe for loads of coins or something and you get to pick your main. Seems stupid to have a cosmetic system but then lock it with perks. And yes, it's soul purpose is countering people wearing defence boosts. Seems almost pointless if you ask me as they almost exactly cancel each other out. If everyone in the community agrees not to use them then we can continue without them and build classes without.



What exactly are you looking for? The gist is you can order gear from anyone you see standing around as long as it is not promo or story mode gear. Depending on its * rating it will cost more/less. You can order up to 3 at a time but only 1 gets delivered per day and if you don't buy it that day then Spyke dumps it (what a waste). The sub-abilities get wiped so you have to re-earn them.



Great thread mate a lot of working going into that, can't wait to see it expand further. One question I have is do you know whether someone can have 3 mains of the same ability and then subs of that ability that stack even further? I'm trying to work out the sums behind Defence Up at the moment. The book says 20% total stack, but the figure I keep getting off the dummies is 12.5% leading me to think that the remaining 7.5% comes from 9 sub abilities at 0.83333% each. Are you able to shed any light on this theory?



It's a very good question. I haven;t been able to find a firm answer yet and the book doesn't mention it directly. There's a lot of people testing - Soul Train above being a great example. Not sure if there is a firm answer on this yet, but I too am experimenting.




Unfortunately the guide stops at the release day content with only vague references to new maps. It's a real shame because that means there is no stats on any new weapons nor, as you mention, new abilities. I am hoping they release a second edition once they have finished releasing content because there is some seriously good intel in this book



Tis a good question. The book clearly states "up to" on each ability. Ink Saver is up to 60%. It *implies* that this means 3 main abilities and no subs. What it doesn't make clear is what happens if you have 3 main abilities + sub abilities. Myself and others are all independently trying to verify this so watch this space. This wiki article has all the abilities copied out from the book if you are every wondering an ability's max:
http://splatoonwiki.org/wiki/Ability



Nope. Any brands I left off the chart just have "-" next to them in the book, meaning that there is no ability 5x and no ability 1/2x. Every ability is an equal chance of appearing as a sub


Not sure about quitting out. I'd imagine there is hidden code that decides the sub abilities as soon as the item is generated on your save file to prevent people closing the game and trying to reroll. As for 1/2/3 stars there is no potency difference. Run speed sub ability on an item with 1* is the same as an item with 3*... Just 3* has 3 sub abilities, basically! If you add more abilities with Spyke they are just as powerful as an item that had 3 to start with

You dont always get the subs people have when you order them or stuff...basically, when you order stuff, you dont get the excat same item

 

[Deleted Member]

If I increase the slots of a piece of clothing, is it permanent? Will I keep the extra slot even if I order the same gear from Spyke or reroll my sub-abilities? How do I change my main ability? Can I reset for different main and sub abilities?

 

[Zonderion]

If I increase the slots of a piece of clothing, is it permanent? Will I keep the extra slot even if I order the same gear from Spyke or reroll my sub-abilities? How do I change my main ability? Can I reset for different main and sub abilities?

Yes, any slots added will be permanent.
You can reset the sub abilities, but as far as I understand it, you can never change the main ability. Any items (purchased or ordered from Spyke) will be their own unique item. So you can order multiple of a single item if you wanted too. This will not affect the number of slots on any other item.

 

[Deleted Member]

Yes, any slots added will be permanent.
You can reset the sub abilities, but as far as I understand it, you can never change the main ability. Any items (purchased or ordered from Spyke) will be their own unique item. So you can order multiple of a single item if you wanted too. This will not affect the number of slots on any other item.

So if I buy a hat from the shop, upgrade the slots, and order the same hat from Spyke, it'll be a duplicate hat with the upgraded slot kept?

 

[Casperr]

So if I buy a hat from the shop, upgrade the slots, and order the same hat from Spyke, it'll be a duplicate hat with the upgraded slot kept?

Not from my understanding. If you buy hat with 2 slots, upgrade with Spyke to have 3 slots and then see another person with that hat but only 2 slots and then ask Spyke to order it, when you try and buy it from Sypke it will only have 2 slots and will replace your upgraded one with 3 slots. Incidentally, why would you want to do that? If you want to change the sub abilities on your hat you can take it to Spyke and re-roll the sub abilities once you reach level 20.

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

Not from my understanding. If you buy hat with 2 slots, upgrade with Spyke to have 3 slots and then see another person with that hat but only 2 slots and then ask Spyke to order it, when you try and buy it from Sypke it will only have 2 slots and will replace your upgraded one with 3 slots. Incidentally, why would you want to do that? If you want to change the sub abilities on your hat you can take it to Spyke and re-roll the sub abilities once you reach level 20.

Sometimes man, sometimes RNGJesus is just not on your side ;w;

 

[Deleted Member]

Not from my understanding. If you buy hat with 2 slots, upgrade with Spyke to have 3 slots and then see another person with that hat but only 2 slots and then ask Spyke to order it, when you try and buy it from Sypke it will only have 2 slots and will replace your upgraded one with 3 slots. Incidentally, why would you want to do that? If you want to change the sub abilities on your hat you can take it to Spyke and re-roll the sub abilities once you reach level 20.

So what if there's a piece of clothing I want and it has the wrong main ability?

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

So what if there's a piece of clothing I want and it has the wrong main ability?

You get a different piece. Fashion is limited.

 

[Casperr]

So what if there's a piece of clothing I want and it has the wrong main ability?

As GeneralLight said - there is no way around this. I think it is truly a weakness of the game. It begs the question why implement a cosmetic system if you're going to lock it into the perk system? They're making players choose between looking how they want to vs having a competitive advantage in the areas they want to. I'm hopeful that Nintendo will implement a way to reroll your main ability, perhaps by paying Spyke similarly to how you can reroll sub abilities, but that's just a hope