Ink or Sink Tournament! v.1.1b Final Version!

[Box]

I just stated that I won't disclose any information, I will inform you that it will help teams that only have one entry

Since we're talking about secret rules that give certain teams advantages, I think you should explain what's going on. Let's start with what exactly you mean by teams having multiple entries.

 

[Math]

Since we're talking about secret rules that give certain teams advantages, I think you should explain what's going on. Let's start with what exactly you mean by teams having multiple entries.

Each squad is allowed to enter three teams of 4-8 players. This is common knowledge at this point. And, like I said, these "secret" rules, aren't rules at all. They're just countermeasures to thin the gap between squads that have 2 or 3 teams entering, and squads that only have 1 team entering. These countermeasures are not giving anyone an advantage, they're just thinning the gap between squads that are entering 1 team and squads that statistically have a 2x-3x better chance of making finals.

thanks for asking! for any future questions, we made an Ink or Sink q&a: http://squidboards.com/threads/ink-or-sink-q-a.4019/

 

[Box]

Each squad is allowed to enter three teams of 4-8 players. This is common knowledge at this point. And, like I said, these "secret" rules, aren't rules at all. They're just countermeasures to thin the gap between squads that have 2 or 3 teams entering, and squads that only have 1 team entering. These countermeasures are not giving anyone an advantage, they're just thinning the gap between squads that are entering 1 team and squads that statistically have a 2x-3x better chance of making finals.

thanks for asking! for any future questions, we made an Ink or Sink q&a: http://squidboards.com/threads/ink-or-sink-q-a.4019/

Why do "squads" even enter into this? You have a number of registered teams. You need to justify why you can't just treat them all equally. As far as I know, I never even signed up for a "squad".

 

[Math]

Why do "squads" even enter into this? You have a number of registered teams. You need to justify why you can't just treat them all equally. As far as I know, I never even signed up for a "squad".

okay, so since you aren't a part of a squad, so you've entered as a single team

you're literally benefiting from what we're discussing right now, so i don't see why you're complaining

about half of the teams that have entered have been a part of a squad that has entered more than one team

we're trying to help you out here, man

 

[Box]

okay, so since you aren't a part of a squad, so you've entered as a single team

you're literally benefiting from what we're discussing right now, so i don't see why you're complaining

about half of the teams that have entered have been a part of a squad that has entered more than one team

we're trying to help you out here, man

I don't want help. I want a fair tournament.

I'm going to help speed this along a bit. I didn't want to jump into the accusations without clarification but we're at this point. I assume by "squad" you mean some sort of overarching collective group like Squid Squad or Squiddernauts. Then by "team" you mean Squid Squad Clubs or Squiddernauts Omega. A squad without multiple teams would be C-. I don't see any reason to make a formal distinction between these two types of teams. Each team is bound to the same limits on number of members and substitutions. There's no inherent advantage had by different teams depending on the size of the informal group from which they come.

 

[Math]

I don't want help. I want a fair tournament.

I'm going to help speed this along a bit. I didn't want to jump into the accusations without clarification but we're at this point. I assume by "squad" you mean some sort of overarching collective group like Squid Squad or Squiddernauts. Then by "team" you mean Squid Squad Clubs or Squiddernauts Omega. A squad without multiple teams would be C-. I don't see any reason to make a formal distinction between these two types of teams. Each team is bound to the same limits on number of members and substitutions. There's no inherent advantage had by different teams depending on the size of the informal group from which they come.

there is though

statistically, a squad with 2 teams has twice the chance of making it to finals as an independent single team

we don't want 3 teams from the same squad taking top 3, but it's possible. (looking at you, imperious)

what we're doing is making things more fair for all teams. end of story.

although you, personally, may not think squads to be a big deal, the majority of the community does. and that majority doesn't want squads dominating tournaments just because the have numbers.

a little confusing, we know, but you're just gonna have to trust us on this. there are no secret rules, we're just putting things in place to make things as fair as possible for all teams. the things we're doing have absolutely nothing to do with gameplay, or any kind of inside communication.

 

[Power]

@Math
Like i said in the chat, this goes back to the limit of teams allowed in the tourney. If certain squads dominate, that is a testament to their skill. But for interests sake, to avoid having a total tourney domination by one squad with overwhelming numbers, I believe we should limit the amount of squads allowed in a tourney.

Edit: @Box, Remember, this is a testfire. We are trying out this set of rules. I believe that it raises interest if one squad does not purely dominate the entire tourney (because of sheer numbers). It may be less competitve? sure. But remember we are trying to make the community bigger. I am going to take an example from basketball.
(Not the greatest analogy, but i hope you can see my point)

A professional basketball team, (From the NBA) brought in a guy from India. He was basically a giant, but he could not play and contributed nothing to the competitiveness of the team. Why bring him in? Marketing reasons.They expanded their product through this player. (or at least hoped to)

This is what we are trying to do with the tourney. If one squad dominated everything, I feel that people would lose interest in the game. The purpose of this is to not only develop the meta of the game, but to raise interest in competitive splatoon.

 

[Spyro]

some many squads :S

 

[Box]

there is though

statistically, a squad with 2 teams has twice the chance of making it to finals as an independent single team

we don't want 3 teams from the same squad taking top 3, but it's possible. (looking at you, imperious)

what we're doing is making things more fair for all teams. end of story.

although you, personally, may not think squads to be a big deal, the majority of the community does. and that majority doesn't want squads dominating tournaments just because the have numbers.

a little confusing, we know, but you're just gonna have to trust us on this. there are no secret rules, we're just putting things in place to make things as fair as possible for all teams. the things we're doing have absolutely nothing to do with gameplay, or any kind of inside communication.

You're admitting to rigging the tournament because you don't want certain groups of people to do too well. This is what your entire reasoning falls back on. There's no real reason for "squads" to even be a factor in this tournament. And your reason for bringing that in is because you want your tournament to play out in a certain way.

Let's remember that individual teams don't see any advantage from being part of a large "squad". You can't even enforce on the basis of "squads". I'm going to be forthcoming here. I was planning on playing on one of the Imperious teams not because I'm formally a part of their clan but because those are the players that I know who are interested in this tournament. There are a lot of people like me who are not formally a part of their clan. Now I could take some of those people and create a clan called Unperious. What can you even do about that? Without any way to verify who is in the clan, you can't distinguish if my team as part of Imperious or not. I want to play in this tournament, not sit on the bench. So I seem to be better off playing as Unperious to get around this flimsy distinction.

You don't have any legitimate justification for this rule. I don't even care if advantage to smaller squads isn't substatial. It's about the precedent. This tournament was hastily thrown together and you've gone back on several rules already because you didn't think them through. I don't see any reason to trust you. I'm half expecting the brackets to be rigged despite you calling them random. This rule is clearly unfair to certain players who happen to be associated with other teams. And I'm not letting this tournament start without making sure that you know exactly how and why.

 

[Math]

You're admitting to rigging the tournament because you don't want certain groups of people to do too well. This is what your entire reasoning falls back on. There's no real reason for "squads" to even be a factor in this tournament. And your reason for bringing that in is because you want your tournament to play out in a certain way.

Let's remember that individual teams don't see any advantage from being part of a large "squad". You can't even enforce on the basis of "squads". I'm going to be forthcoming here. I was planning on playing on one of the Imperious teams not because I'm formally a part of their clan but because those are the players that I know who are interested in this tournament. There are a lot of people like me who are not formally a part of their clan. Now I could take some of those people and create a clan called Unperious. What can you even do about that? Without any way to verify who is in the clan, you can't distinguish if my team as part of Imperious or not. I want to play in this tournament, not sit on the bench. So I seem to be better off playing as Unperious to get around this flimsy distinction.

You don't have any legitimate justification for this rule. I don't even care if advantage to smaller squads isn't substatial. It's about the precedent. This tournament was hastily thrown together and you've gone back on several rules already because you didn't think them through. I don't see any reason to trust you. I'm half expecting the brackets to be rigged despite you calling them random. This rule is clearly unfair to certain players who happen to be associated with other teams. And I'm not letting this tournament start without making sure that you know exactly how and why.

we're literally not rigging the tourney. if you don't like what we're doing, you don't have to enter.

also, we explicitly state in the OP that this is a sort of beta tournament, which is why rules are being changed and results aren't being formally recorded. we'll consider your points in the 1.1 ruleset, but this really isn't something worth getting upset about. it's a test tournament.

and stating that you're "not letting this tournament start" is really silly, as we have over 200 people registered already.

Saying this tournament was "hastily thrown together" is incredibly insulting, as the whopping 5 devs have been fine-tuning the ruleset around the clock for a week and a half.

if you want to make your own squad and enter, you're totally free to do that, but you won't get any sort of advantage. this tournament is community-driven, and ideas for modifications to the ruleset that are being considered are coming in from over 110 people. we know what you're doing, and people trust us, because we have hard-earned integrity within this community, and if you don't trust us, you don't have to enter.

 

[Moy]

we're literally not rigging the tourney. if you don't like what we're doing, you don't have to enter.

also, we explicitly state in the OP that this is a sort of beta tournament, which is why rules are being changed and results aren't being formally recorded. we'll consider your points in the 1.1 ruleset, but this really isn't something worth getting upset about. it's a test tournament.

and stating that you're "not letting this tournament start" is really silly, as we have over 200 people registered already.

Saying this tournament was "hastily thrown together" is incredibly insulting, as the whopping 5 devs have been fine-tuning the ruleset around the clock for a week and a half.

if you want to make your own squad and enter, you're totally free to do that, but you won't get any sort of advantage. this tournament is community-driven, and ideas for modifications to the ruleset that are being considered are coming in from over 110 people. we know what you're doing, and people trust us, because we have hard-earned integrity within this community, and if you don't trust us, you don't have to enter.

The first mistake you made was to single out one clan (Imperious).

 

[Math]

The first mistake you made was single out one clan (Imperious).

i never singled out imperious

 

[Power]

Just to be clear, there are several squads who have several teams joining, not just imperious. If that is what you were getting at @Moy

 

[Moy]

statistically, a squad with 2 teams has twice the chance of making it to finals as an independent single team

we don't want 3 teams from the same squad taking top 3, but it's possible. (looking at you, imperious)

 

[Math]

that was just a joke. imperious is really good, so i wouldn't be surprised if they took top 3. this was a compliment. sorry for the confusion.

 

[flc]

that was just a joke. imperious is really good, so i wouldn't be surprised if they took top 3. this was a compliment. sorry for the confusion.

perhaps, then, it would have been better to word it as a compliment instead of making a rule about it.

this is the first major tournament for splatoon. what this tournament does will set precedents for future tournaments. as such, you should avoid setting precedents that could potentially be harmful, such as making some rule that discourages teams from fielding multiple squads.

we're running 2-3 squads because we have a whole lot of people who want to get a taste of comp play. I'm not sure why the possibility that we take top 3 (which I don't think we will) would be a problem. if anything, I would hope that it might motivate teams to improve.

 

[Draayder]

I agree with Box on this, it ends up looking super shady to single out a squad (even as a joke), it just makes it look like you're making rules specifically to stop that squad from succeeding even if they deserve it. I also think squads probably shouldn't be a factor in this, it is a very good point on people making squads just for this. Just going off of the entered teams and ignoring squad affiliation, especially since squads are so loose and informal anyways with numbers ranging from exactly 4 to dozens, would be the cleanest way to do this.

Personal opinion but if Imperious did take all 3 top spots somehow, then they deserve it, they were 3 teams of excellent players who earned their win. If my team came in second but I knew Imperious got hobbled by rules I'd feel like I didn't really earn my spot.

 

[Burritoburger]

Let's remember that individual teams don't see any advantage from being part of a large "squad".

>Squads with multiple teams can report observations to each other about enemy teams they meet in bracket
>Other teams for that squad is now better off because they know the strats of the enemy teams
>TOs are attempting to give single teams more of an advantage because of this

u wot
why are you even complaining about a tourney that is practically all about testing how a tourney plays out? this is the first major splatoon tournament that's ever been organized, of course it's not gonna be perfect

 

[[EJ]_Locke]

I don't even care about you singling about Imperious, but I do agree with Box. And if you are offended by the Imperious used as an example you really need to think about your priorities here instead of complaining over nothing.

 

[Citrus]

Why is it bad if a team takes the top spots? That just means they are good and deserve it. It's not right to try and make something appealing to viewers and act like the players don't care.