S rank battle problems

[MeTaGross]

I just want to know if others are having this problem...

I do a lot of S rank battles, and I recently made it to S+, but I have noticed that many of the battles change about halfway through and flip. There have been so many battles where my team is ahead most of the match, the other team makes a push and passes us, and then we lose. This happens very often is all modes and I really don't like it.

To illustrate, I played splat zones the other day on piranha pit and we got the counter down to 2. We lost control for a while, and then when they reached 50 in overtime I really thought we were actually going to lose in overtime! This is not a problem that should be happening every battle!

 

[NESS☆OctoCece]

My friend has this problem a lot he's always tell me about it.
They take the lead and it's like the team just gives up and they end up losing .

 

[Leronne]

It's not really an S rank battle problem though. It's basically just your teammates (and maybe even you, not saying it is) not doing a good job at defending the objective. I've lost a lot of battles in overtime when we had the commanding lead, but it wasn't the battle that was the problem. It was me, my teammates or both that didn't do well in the last seconds of the match.

 

[Hero of Lime]

Yeah, that can be a common issue. A lesson to learn for every mode, and every rank, NEVER get comfortable, or ease up just because you are winning. Ranked battles can literally be almost won, only to have a total turn around and the other team making a comeback win. Even in S and S+ lobbies, I see players get too comfortable, or get too reckless when they have a nice lead. I used to be the same, I would make overly risky plays, or get too deep into enemy territory to try and keep the enemy team back, only to get easily beaten by two enemies, and they overrun my team to reclaim the objective.

Something that perplexed me yesterday, playing rainmaker, it's amazing how few people want to grab it on my teams. I don't mind grabbing it, but sometimes I had a special ready to use, yet the rest of my teammates were just ignoring it, and we needed to get it moved, so I would be forced tograb it. Just an S rank battle problem I've encountered myself.

To me, it's less stressful to grab the rainmaker as opposed to riding on the tower, but people seem to prefer getting on the the tower than grabbing the RM. I get the pressure is on when carrying the RM, but everyone should know that having the RM means it's pretty easy to be splatted. There is no shame in getting killed while holding it. Making some ground is better than just sitting around waiting for someone else to do it. I hate to imagine people caring more about their K/D as opposed to actually doing the objective.

 

[EBJustin]

What happens a lot of the time is a team slowly but surely establishes a dominating presence on the playing field, claiming map control and using strategic points of the map and stealth to splat the foes trying to enter. You may have a really good team when establishing what appears to be complete control, or a team that simply knows what to do at that place in time. However, once someone on the team slips up, it can lead to a chain reaction and possibly a team wipe due to a special weapon being used or misplays. What then happens is the team that once had dominating control is slowly losing map control and each teammate is approaching in a lackluster fashion, not able to take out the enemy team who is slowly establishing control finally. This continues for the rest of the match as their special gauge is still experiencing a gradual increase from losing. The enemy team then continues to establish control until they take the lead and end up winning.

You can also have really good teams battling it out, but once a team retakes control, they really know how to take advantage of that control and the other team isn't accomplishing much when trying to shift control of the objective. You need to know how to play smart. Maintain a smart, defensive play while knowing how to approach those who will eventually attempt to push into your control. Also, know the routes in which enemy players are coming and expect them to come from anywhere, because eventually a person or two on the other team will get tired of the route they are taking and choose a different route which no one expects.

Otherwise, there are simply moments where aside from not approaching correctly, the team as a whole is taken out and while attempting to retake control smartly, the other team simply outplays everyone and control is maintained. Sorry if this comes out as confusing or anything of the sort, but I feel these are some problems faced by teams who establish good control but eventually make misplays and end up throwing the game because of it.

 

[Rabite]

This is normal in any kind of higher competitive play for many other games than Splatoon. If somebody has made it all the way to S+, it means they know how to play the game at a level most never will. Your opponents have the skill to push back, and if you give them an inch you'll be destroyed.

If you're uncomfortable with it, you can always rank down! ;)

 

[MeTaGross]

The problem is what you guys are saying, but it also isn't. What EBJustin said made the most actual sense, but none of you can see the battles, so there is a small communication error. In most battles if we take a large lead I try to prevent them from coming back, not us pushing forward. I cover the mid and some paths to our side, then I head to the objective. The problem is, I don't usually make the lead, my team does, but then they end up dying after leading, and I don't know why. Do you think I should try and push more and focus less on preventing them from coming back? I know I am not bad, I made it to S+ and I always play solidly, so if there is any advice you have I would appreciate it. If not I will keep trying, as I did win a rainmaker battle where we always led, but they still almost made a push to beat us in the middle of the battle! Thankfully, I actually played very well, better than usual, and we stopped them.

 

[EBJustin]

If you feel more comfortable with developing a more aggressive play-style, then that is completely up to you. Of course there is such a thing as too aggressive based on how good you are, so make sure you know your limits (both weapon and actual skill limits) before approaching certain situations. Always try to form a plan beforehand, but have a backup plan in mind if the opposing team doesn't do what you expected them to do. I think it's quite clear though that if your teams are losing more so than winning, you need to help them with pushing the enemy team back because from what I can foresee, your team eventually slips up due to misplays/unable to avoid a special weapon. You are then left to basically fend for yourself or in a 2v4. That can be quite difficult with pressure from all sides of the map enclosing you into a specific area concentrated with enemy players. So ultimately, yes, contributing to the "driving force" may be a strategy worth trying out as it seems you might not be giving your team enough support when it matters later on in the game, even though you are helping with map control and other nifty things that can help out. Don't change your play-style completely, but experiment with being a little more aggressive while taking into account the weapon you are using.

 

[MeTaGross]

Thank you guys for all the suggestions!

So ultimately, yes, contributing to the "driving force" may be a strategy worth trying out as it seems you might not be giving your team enough support when it matters later on in the game

Not what I meant, I might not give them enough support during the push, but I'm always there to give support later in the game. ;)

 

[Award]

I've experienced that a lot too. It's especially problematic in zones for some reason, but it does occur in all modes. As others said, teams get too comfortable and tend to assume they've won. Worse, the players that are not the ones that made the push and established the lead, I believe, tend to assume that whatever they were doing, even if it was not helpful or majorly contributing, must indeed be a contribution and continue doing it (inking behind enemy lines where no one is, etc. etc.) Or some will assume "other players are going to win it" so they don't have to approach the front lines etc. Other times, it's just a simply good play by the other team a good push, a lucky stacked special run by a coordinated team, but following that, later in the game, I find my teams tend to give up and assume they can no longer win and stop trying to turn it around, despite that in Splatoon you can ALWAYS turn it around unless you're down to a spawncamp in 10 seconds.

I've taken sometimes to NOT trying to claim an early lead, especially in zones and TC, not so much RM where anything can happen - and working on playing TW for the first 2:30 or so. It keeps my teams on their toes longer :P I've noticed also Japanese players are more likely to do exactly that. They're not always GOOD players mind you, there's some pretty awful players in Japan, and I've played with every one of them ;) But when in Rome...or Kyoto...

Some have pointed out that in Japanese culture it's considered a dishonor to continue fighting when you cannot win. I.E. surrender is an honorable action when you've determined you're defeated. Considering I tend to play mostly with Japanese players I can't help but wonder if that sometimes plays into it. Though I would think, by now, players experienced enough to be in upper ranks should know they indeed can win still.

Something that perplexed me yesterday, playing rainmaker, it's amazing how few people want to grab it on my teams. I don't mind grabbing it, but sometimes I had a special ready to use, yet the rest of my teammates were just ignoring it, and we needed to get it moved, so I would be forced tograb it. Just an S rank battle problem I've encountered myself.

To me, it's less stressful to grab the rainmaker as opposed to riding on the tower, but people seem to prefer getting on the the tower than grabbing the RM. I get the pressure is on when carrying the RM, but everyone should know that having the RM means it's pretty easy to be splatted. There is no shame in getting killed while holding it. Making some ground is better than just sitting around waiting for someone else to do it. I hate to imagine people caring more about their K/D as opposed to actually doing the objective.

Yeah, it's a weird epidemic where players pop the shield, then continue to fight around the RM or leave it entirely untouched for lengths of time. I know some people use that as a strategy - wait until you get a team wipe to push the objective, but I have mixed feelings about that as a strategy. You're handing opportunities to the opponents, and often enough I can run and parkour around with the RM and deliver a significant lead where my teammates would have been happy leaving the thing laying in the mud. It doesn't always work, it's a risk, but it seems to be fairly dependable that you'll post a higher score running the RM than leaving it sitting on the ground. And it seems when opponents relentlessly ram it into our base wave after wave, they seem likely to win. Seems to be just me though. In an average RM game the RM sits for up to 3 minutes sitting, unshielded, on the ground unless I grab it. :p I sometimes wonder if Team Deathmatch were a game mode apart from ranked, if anyone would play ranked at all :p

I'm like you I like RM carrying more than tower riding, specifically because there's a map awareness challenge involved -I can choose any path and try to outrun them, and use my 1337 platforming skillz honed since 1980's Mario to good effect. Drifting along a track is scary by contrast :) But I think others like the tower more because they can easily get off and BATTLE, and abandon it, while once you grab the RM, it's forev-SPLAAT!

 

[Xehias]

I think the issue here is the lack of a good support player on most teams. I am that player in RM and TC with my trusty Krak-On, and generally, if we have the lead and nothing goes horribly wrong, I can hold a S rank team back until the rest of my teammates respawn. It's a matter of hanging back and taking opportunities.

The way I play Krak-On is like this: Beakons are for helping with pushes and getting right back into the action when the leading offensive gets splatted. I generally don't go near the front lines if there aren't at least some Beakons up. When I see someone pushing the tower, I stay behind and put Beakons on the way—essentially making mid a temporary part of our own base. Once I get started with my setup, it's really tough for enemy teams to come back. Just today, I got from S 70 to S+45 or so using this strategy on Mall/Underpass TC, and I don't think I lost a single game on the way to S+.

Kraken is multipurpose—stopping a push, assisting a push (by serving as a distraction or getting splats), or forcing a push (really good to forcibly get past a rough zone or getting the last few points needed for taking the lead). I'm always that one person hanging in the back to make sure we don't lose map control or the lead if all three others get splatted. Push went awry? Just jump to me or one of the Beakons and save the lead!

Basically what I mean is, don't be afraid to stay back and be an opportunist. This is the best way to end pushes before they even get started. (Sorry for the really messy post, I'm on mobile.)

 

[Award]

I think the issue here is the lack of a good support player on most teams. I am that player in RM and TC with my trusty Krak-On, and generally, if we have the lead and nothing goes horribly wrong, I can hold a S rank team back until the rest of my teammates respawn. It's a matter of hanging back and taking opportunities.

The way I play Krak-On is like this: Beakons are for helping with pushes and getting right back into the action when the leading offensive gets splatted. I generally don't go near the front lines if there aren't at least some Beakons up. When I see someone pushing the tower, I stay behind and put Beakons on the way—essentially making mid a temporary part of our own base. Once I get started with my setup, it's really tough for enemy teams to come back. Just today, I got from S 70 to S+45 or so using this strategy on Mall/Underpass TC, and I don't think I lost a single game on the way to S+.

Kraken is multipurpose—stopping a push, assisting a push (by serving as a distraction or getting splats), or forcing a push (really good to forcibly get past a rough zone or getting the last few points needed for taking the lead). I'm always that one person hanging in the back to make sure we don't lose map control or the lead if all three others get splatted. Push went awry? Just jump to me or one of the Beakons and save the lead!

Basically what I mean is, don't be afraid to stay back and be an opportunist. This is the best way to end pushes before they even get started. (Sorry for the really messy post, I'm on mobile.)

That strategy makes a lot of sense, however, I'd also say that it's extremely dependent upon your teammates to play dedicated support like that. If your teammates are very poor at pushing, it won't be effective. The teams MeTaGross described sound a lot like mine - their problem is not that they are so focused on driving the objective that they need a dedicated support player to back them up - it's that all three of them are trying to be the one that hangs back and plays support, and they're all waiting on us to be the one to go drive the objective alone. I've played games where I'm the sniper (kind of obligatorily the one who stays back as support by definition!) and I've had to get on the tower myself because they would not - and I see all three of them in phalanx formation hiding BEHIND the tower for protection, as the tower plunges into 4 waiting squids in the enemy base. They weren't trying to defend the tower during it's push - they were using the tower as cover to keep their k/d positive. Do they jump on the tower in series when I get splatted off to keep the momentum? No, they scatter, and let it reset to mid. I've see that many times - full teams of people playing the role you describe, and no one on the front lines.

Not to undermine the level of skill involved in what you describe. Often as the sniping role I'm that last squid trying to hold off the 4 squids advancing when my team is splatted, but there's no way at all to do it alone without ending up splatted myself I'll often get two and trade on the 3rd or get 3 and trade on the forth, etc. - if you can pull that off without getting splatted, that's amazing. But I do imagine your teams are a bit more competent than the ones we're talking about. I'm more comfortable playing that role in S/S+ squad lobbies where I know most of my team are guaranteed dependable than in solo where so often they just don't seem that way. I can usually tell quickly if they are or not.

I do sometimes wonder how much a role time zone and demographic plays into it. You're in France as is Binx - he's described similar types of adaptability as you and is also a high-S+ player and also seems to have more reliable teams than some of us tend to get. I sometimes wonder if the matchmaker tries to match you with your own region (other than when it throws you to Japan) and if NoA region players are more likely to get the clueless kids who tend to make up Nintendo's base here who are relying on others to carry them versus NoE that I believe has an older demographic. Though I also tend to get primarily Japanese players, but when I'm likely to play it's late morning in Japan - maybe it's the kids who are home playing then too (We can all admit it - we've all been crushed by Japanese 4 year olds...) . Your time zone tends to play when Japan is asleep except for the Japanese equivalent of Mtn Dew/Doritos gamers (WasaBeef Gamers?) :) I'm noticing a pattern that players that seem to not have serious team composition problems tend to NOT be in NoA territory.

 

[Peachfanclub]

I almost won a Tower Control match today. I got the counter down to 1. Wenk Kraken and all to ensure that I would get to the goal.

Then I got splatted.

Then we lost.

 

[Xehias]

That strategy makes a lot of sense, however, I'd also say that it's extremely dependent upon your teammates to play dedicated support like that. If your teammates are very poor at pushing, it won't be effective. The teams MeTaGross described sound a lot like mine - their problem is not that they are so focused on driving the objective that they need a dedicated support player to back them up - it's that all three of them are trying to be the one that hangs back and plays support, and they're all waiting on us to be the one to go drive the objective alone. I've played games where I'm the sniper (kind of obligatorily the one who stays back as support by definition!) and I've had to get on the tower myself because they would not - and I see all three of them in phalanx formation hiding BEHIND the tower for protection, as the tower plunges into 4 waiting squids in the enemy base. They weren't trying to defend the tower during it's push - they were using the tower as cover to keep their k/d positive. Do they jump on the tower in series when I get splatted off to keep the momentum? No, they scatter, and let it reset to mid. I've see that many times - full teams of people playing the role you describe, and no one on the front lines.

Not to undermine the level of skill involved in what you describe. Often as the sniping role I'm that last squid trying to hold off the 4 squids advancing when my team is splatted, but there's no way at all to do it alone without ending up splatted myself I'll often get two and trade on the 3rd or get 3 and trade on the forth, etc. - if you can pull that off without getting splatted, that's amazing. But I do imagine your teams are a bit more competent than the ones we're talking about. I'm more comfortable playing that role in S/S+ squad lobbies where I know most of my team are guaranteed dependable than in solo where so often they just don't seem that way. I can usually tell quickly if they are or not.

I do sometimes wonder how much a role time zone and demographic plays into it. You're in France as is Binx - he's described similar types of adaptability as you and is also a high-S+ player and also seems to have more reliable teams than some of us tend to get. I sometimes wonder if the matchmaker tries to match you with your own region (other than when it throws you to Japan) and if NoA region players are more likely to get the clueless kids who tend to make up Nintendo's base here who are relying on others to carry them versus NoE that I believe has an older demographic. Though I also tend to get primarily Japanese players, but when I'm likely to play it's late morning in Japan - maybe it's the kids who are home playing then too (We can all admit it - we've all been crushed by Japanese 4 year olds...) . Your time zone tends to play when Japan is asleep except for the Japanese equivalent of Mtn Dew/Doritos gamers (WasaBeef Gamers?) :) I'm noticing a pattern that players that seem to not have serious team composition problems tend to NOT be in NoA territory.

Yeah, playing solely support in anything but S+ (and S if you’re lucky) is usually going to end badly, unless you know how to adapt. By "support" I actually mean I am an opportunist, taking few risks (by staying behind, placing Beakons and splatting careless foes) and reaping great rewards (keeping the enemy team locked in place while my own respawns and jumps to my Beakons to pick up the offensive again). As I said, I can pretty reliably get a winning streak getting me from S 70 to S+ using the Krak-On/(Tempered) Dynamo during a good rotation.

Still, I know what you mean. I play almost only solo queue in S/S+ rank lobbies and I still have to deal with teams who just won’t pick up the Rainmaker, even though I’m using a Dynamo… Like, okay, I’ll pick it up, but don’t expect me to get anywhere with that speed nerf. It’s really frustrating when that happens, but I guess players are just dead set on following the role they had in mind starting the match, regardless of rank. However, when I can use my beloved Krak-On strategy on RM/TC, my teammates tend to understand and play along. I don’t think I’ve seen many cases of there being too many support players. Occasionally, I’ll get paired with another one, but it’s never much of an issue. I actually find it pretty amusing when me and that player go to place Beakons at roughly the same spots at the beginning of the game! On top of this, when I see I have the only long-range/short-range weapon on my team or if we’re all roughly the same range, I mentally prepare myself to play more or less aggressively to compensate for the odd matchup. So for instance, if I’m using the Krak-On with a short-ranged team, I’ll be extra careful and play very defensively because I know my teammates are going to get splatted constantly. I can’t begin to count the number of matches where I was the one who stopped most, if not all of the enemy pushes all by myself.

As for my teammates’ locations, I do get paired with seven Japanese players all the time when I play around 6 PM. And since it’s 1 AM where they live, it makes sense that I’d deal with competent teams more often than not. Players with Western names start showing up a little later in the evening. Of course, I can’t tell whether they’re American or European just from name alone, but chances are it’s more of the latter due to timezones. Overall, I rarely have to complain about connection issues, aside from the occasional laggy game or DC. Incompetent teams are the exception rather than the rule, too. I guess I’m pretty lucky in that regard! (And no, I almost never play squads. I feel like the skill level of people there is really weird from the handful of twin squad matches I’ve played. It’s not necessarily worse than in solo queue, but… I dunno, it just feels different.)

 

[mercenariez]

I almost won a Tower Control match today. I got the counter down to 1. Wenk Kraken and all to ensure that I would get to the goal.

Then I got splatted.

Then we lost.

This has probably happened to me over a dozen times. Once you die it's all downhill.

People need to stop slacking off just cuz you have a lead. Especially at the end. Finish the match by bringing the rainmaker back to our base or something and then you can start squidbagging. I remember some idiot squidbagging with the rainmaker right in the middle, since time was almost up, and then he got splatted by an eliter, so it went into OT. F f s

 

[MeTaGross]

After regaining S+ yesterday I played a match of tower control on arowana mall. It was a good match, we started off slowly but we held the lead most of the second half. I was using the custom jet squelcher and went 10-8, which is pretty good for me. In the last 30 seconds of the match they pushed the tower to around 40ish to take the lead with 5 seconds left. That really sucked. Me and a teammate both cleared the tower, and I had a kraken ready. We crossed mid with no resistance and then I shot their tentatek, krakened and took out somebody else and we pushed for over time victory. Two lead changes in the last 5 seconds of the match, and we somehow won.

 

[Award]

Yeah, playing solely support in anything but S+ (and S if you’re lucky) is usually going to end badly, unless you know how to adapt. By "support" I actually mean I am an opportunist, taking few risks (by staying behind, placing Beakons and splatting careless foes) and reaping great rewards (keeping the enemy team locked in place while my own respawns and jumps to my Beakons to pick up the offensive again). As I said, I can pretty reliably get a winning streak getting me from S 70 to S+ using the Krak-On/(Tempered) Dynamo during a good rotation.

Still, I know what you mean. I play almost only solo queue in S/S+ rank lobbies and I still have to deal with teams who just won’t pick up the Rainmaker, even though I’m using a Dynamo… Like, okay, I’ll pick it up, but don’t expect me to get anywhere with that speed nerf. It’s really frustrating when that happens, but I guess players are just dead set on following the role they had in mind starting the match, regardless of rank. However, when I can use my beloved Krak-On strategy on RM/TC, my teammates tend to understand and play along. I don’t think I’ve seen many cases of there being too many support players. Occasionally, I’ll get paired with another one, but it’s never much of an issue. I actually find it pretty amusing when me and that player go to place Beakons at roughly the same spots at the beginning of the game! On top of this, when I see I have the only long-range/short-range weapon on my team or if we’re all roughly the same range, I mentally prepare myself to play more or less aggressively to compensate for the odd matchup. So for instance, if I’m using the Krak-On with a short-ranged team, I’ll be extra careful and play very defensively because I know my teammates are going to get splatted constantly. I can’t begin to count the number of matches where I was the one who stopped most, if not all of the enemy pushes all by myself.

As for my teammates’ locations, I do get paired with seven Japanese players all the time when I play around 6 PM. And since it’s 1 AM where they live, it makes sense that I’d deal with competent teams more often than not. Players with Western names start showing up a little later in the evening. Of course, I can’t tell whether they’re American or European just from name alone, but chances are it’s more of the latter due to timezones. Overall, I rarely have to complain about connection issues, aside from the occasional laggy game or DC. Incompetent teams are the exception rather than the rule, too. I guess I’m pretty lucky in that regard! (And no, I almost never play squads. I feel like the skill level of people there is really weird from the handful of twin squad matches I’ve played. It’s not necessarily worse than in solo queue, but… I dunno, it just feels different.)

Yeah the trouble with the pure support/opportunistic play like that is how dependent on a quality team (any kind of quality!) it becomes. With good teammates it can be the decisive role that prevents any opposing comeback at all. Minus good teammates it makes you accidentally become the front lines while not really trying to play front lines :) I can see it working in S+, I'm not sure how well I can see it working in most S let alone most anything below :) If you're "support" and getting triple and quad kills - you're not really supporting the team, they're supporting your one-mollusk army :)

When I play squads I don't have to worry about my team so much - the role is fluid, whatever needs doing I can do (or try to predict what MIGHT need doing which may or may not work out) but I don't have to worry about monitoring them, I know they know what they're doing and can support or lead accordingly. Solo...hooo boy... I find the more I try to support and "see how I can help my teammates" I want to punch them more than ever, I can lurk behind, if I'm playing a supportive weapon like carbon and try to back them up and end up thinking "what are you DOING? Why would you possibly be going THERE?" And of course they get splatted and I'm left taking out the 3 opponents. Or my favorite, one of them waits at spawn, moves after I leave spawn - ok, they wanted to follow me to support or to camp behind me - cool. Then as we approach enemy ink and I get ready for the likely camping opponents, I realize my follower has peeled off and gone somewhere entirely different - just as 3 squids jump me :P

Interesting about timezones....yeah the occasions I've been able to play more around that time I tend to find the game is generally easier, or, rather, my teammates tend to not require so much babysitting. It's not always the case though. But I feel like I'm more likely to do better if I play at 1:00PM (I believe you're 5 hours ahead of me) than at 10:00PM (3:00AM your time) which is of course when I'm normally playing. Enemies seem 10x fiercer and allies 10x more clueless during that time :) Strangely it's 10:00AM Japan time. Aren't they in work/school by then? But I seem to still get mostly Japanese players. :)
I'd say it's on the super hardcore staying home and playing, but the ones one my team...., 50% of the time they're hardcore, and 50% of the time they're hardcore NintendoLand players or something :P

Squads, IMO feel different because generally all 8 players are actually competent, which isn't something that happens in solo very often (I'm sure in S+ it does, but otherwise, not so much.) Sure you sometimes get the do-nothing squid being carried, but most of the time in S/S+ lobbies it's all fierce, excellent gameplay among fully competent players. I'm not sure why Solo brings incompetence (even in high ranks) and squads seems to appeal to higher level players (Solo seems to be a mix of unbeatable dominating players, and players who can't identify where the zone is). IMO it's probably because a lot of good players that get fed up with the solo queue antics just stop with solo and move to playing their S/S+ accounts in squads exclusively. I've had big wins and big losses in squads. I've had losses and wins in under 40 seconds (fun match last week everyone was battling in Triggerfish RM, and I just walked up, grabbed the RM, and ran it all the way around to dunk it right at the start of the match with a 0/0 k/d. But that wouldn't have been possible without teammates that were AWARE I was running it and knew to keep the enemy away from the gates! No voice chat - just greater awareness than I see in solo. But even with those kind of plays, I just tend not to see the completely imbalanced skill between teams I do in solo.

 

[Xehias]

Yeah the trouble with the pure support/opportunistic play like that is how dependent on a quality team (any kind of quality!) it becomes. With good teammates it can be the decisive role that prevents any opposing comeback at all. Minus good teammates it makes you accidentally become the front lines while not really trying to play front lines :) I can see it working in S+, I'm not sure how well I can see it working in most S let alone most anything below :) If you're "support" and getting triple and quad kills - you're not really supporting the team, they're supporting your one-mollusk army :)

When I play squads I don't have to worry about my team so much - the role is fluid, whatever needs doing I can do (or try to predict what MIGHT need doing which may or may not work out) but I don't have to worry about monitoring them, I know they know what they're doing and can support or lead accordingly. Solo...hooo boy... I find the more I try to support and "see how I can help my teammates" I want to punch them more than ever, I can lurk behind, if I'm playing a supportive weapon like carbon and try to back them up and end up thinking "what are you DOING? Why would you possibly be going THERE?" And of course they get splatted and I'm left taking out the 3 opponents. Or my favorite, one of them waits at spawn, moves after I leave spawn - ok, they wanted to follow me to support or to camp behind me - cool. Then as we approach enemy ink and I get ready for the likely camping opponents, I realize my follower has peeled off and gone somewhere entirely different - just as 3 squids jump me :p

Interesting about timezones....yeah the occasions I've been able to play more around that time I tend to find the game is generally easier, or, rather, my teammates tend to not require so much babysitting. It's not always the case though. But I feel like I'm more likely to do better if I play at 1:00PM (I believe you're 5 hours ahead of me) than at 10:00PM (3:00AM your time) which is of course when I'm normally playing. Enemies seem 10x fiercer and allies 10x more clueless during that time :) Strangely it's 10:00AM Japan time. Aren't they in work/school by then? But I seem to still get mostly Japanese players. :)
I'd say it's on the super hardcore staying home and playing, but the ones one my team...., 50% of the time they're hardcore, and 50% of the time they're hardcore NintendoLand players or something :p

Squads, IMO feel different because generally all 8 players are actually competent, which isn't something that happens in solo very often (I'm sure in S+ it does, but otherwise, not so much.) Sure you sometimes get the do-nothing squid being carried, but most of the time in S/S+ lobbies it's all fierce, excellent gameplay among fully competent players. I'm not sure why Solo brings incompetence (even in high ranks) and squads seems to appeal to higher level players (Solo seems to be a mix of unbeatable dominating players, and players who can't identify where the zone is). IMO it's probably because a lot of good players that get fed up with the solo queue antics just stop with solo and move to playing their S/S+ accounts in squads exclusively. I've had big wins and big losses in squads. I've had losses and wins in under 40 seconds (fun match last week everyone was battling in Triggerfish RM, and I just walked up, grabbed the RM, and ran it all the way around to dunk it right at the start of the match with a 0/0 k/d. But that wouldn't have been possible without teammates that were AWARE I was running it and knew to keep the enemy away from the gates! No voice chat - just greater awareness than I see in solo. But even with those kind of plays, I just tend not to see the completely imbalanced skill between teams I do in solo.

It's true that supportive playstyles can't work without a good team to back them up. I'm not sure how much of how I play could be considered support at this point, though. I do tend to sit back and let people do their thing on the front lines, and I feel like it actually works better in S than in S+. Not because my team's incompetent, but because the enemy team is more likely to get overwhelmed and not know how to recover. Generally, S+ rank players are dead set on not getting knocked out, so they're going to fight tooth and nail even if the score is 100-1.

I'm not sure I would call the Carbon a support weapon, though. But I definitely know that "how did all of them get splatted this fast" feeling. For example, I'll be setting up on a side of Walleye at the beginning of the match and, oh, look at that, everyone's respawning already! And then I have to play catch up with the Rainmaker making a beeline to our goal/splat whoever's gone to destroy my Beakon/spam to me until they realize I'm here. Thankfully, those situations often end up in most of the enemy team getting splatted in turn which allows for a swift recovery.

I don't know how much timezones/the time of playing affect the skill of players, really. I just do my thing without giving it much thought.

I'm sure quad squads that are S/S+ are forces to be reckoned with. Twin squads are more of a mixed bag, in my opinion, and those pretty much are the only ones I have any experience with. I think solo queue is really fun, and it's by far my favorite mode to play. But yeah, actually knowing the people you're playing with can go miles in making them play better as a team. Also, some people who only ever play squads can get complacent. It's important to know how to handle yourself in a team of random people with varying skill levels. It forces you to step up your game and stay on your toes at all times.

 

[Award]

It's true that supportive playstyles can't work without a good team to back them up. I'm not sure how much of how I play could be considered support at this point, though. I do tend to sit back and let people do their thing on the front lines, and I feel like it actually works better in S than in S+. Not because my team's incompetent, but because the enemy team is more likely to get overwhelmed and not know how to recover. Generally, S+ rank players are dead set on not getting knocked out, so they're going to fight tooth and nail even if the score is 100-1.

I'm not sure I would call the Carbon a support weapon, though. But I definitely know that "how did all of them get splatted this fast" feeling. For example, I'll be setting up on a side of Walleye at the beginning of the match and, oh, look at that, everyone's respawning already! And then I have to play catch up with the Rainmaker making a beeline to our goal/splat whoever's gone to destroy my Beakon/spam to me until they realize I'm here. Thankfully, those situations often end up in most of the enemy team getting splatted in turn which allows for a swift recovery.

I don't know how much timezones/the time of playing affect the skill of players, really. I just do my thing without giving it much thought.

I'm sure quad squads that are S/S+ are forces to be reckoned with. Twin squads are more of a mixed bag, in my opinion, and those pretty much are the only ones I have any experience with. I think solo queue is really fun, and it's by far my favorite mode to play. But yeah, actually knowing the people you're playing with can go miles in making them play better as a team. Also, some people who only ever play squads can get complacent. It's important to know how to handle yourself in a team of random people with varying skill levels. It forces you to step up your game and stay on your toes at all times.

Heh, I've ALWAYS fought tooth and nail even if it's 100-1 to prevent KO - if you think players below S+ tend not to that's probably half of why I get so frustrated at my lazy teammates! I thought that was the point - there are POINTS at stake for that last point! :)

Yeah your description of "how did all of them get splatted" describes not just carbon but chargers and hydras all too well too - all of them require setup. Chargers are worse when that happens because by nature you're visible and your position known. Harder to hide than with carbon.

Timezones: I think I tend to think of it due to seeing so much awfulness in solo and then seeing how it varies at different times etc. There are definitely different skill levels throughout the day. My play time has a little notoriety of having more brutal opponents, but I tend to notice that I also seem to get a lot of really awful teammates then, too. Maybe it's just the Japanese players that stayed up straight through the night playing and are burned out :)

Squads, for twins I generally see just good gameplay overall more times than not. No room for complacency surely, though we're talking S/S+ lobbies, but battle is always fierce and less silliness than solo. QUAD squads...that's a whole other thing. Any time I've ever played quad we get matched against a full Japanese clan tournament division and get utterly trashed. It's kind of fun when you can't lose points, but I wouldn't play quad with any expectation of winning. These guys seem to be the best of the best, massively coordinated, and with dedicated map strategies and roles. It's not about winning, it's about seeing if you can get to mid at least once, and I take my close prevention of knockout as a big achievement :p It's a whole different tier beyond regular S+ rooms. Non-tournament class players need not apply :)

 

[maxie]

i noticed how big of a problem this was when i had a teammate while i was in s rank who decided to take the rainmaker and run towards the other team with it while we were in the lead with a few seconds left, taunting them and jumped down where he was easily splatted, about four points from them taking the lead. other team got the rainmaker, took a few steps and we'd lost because of one person deciding to be ****y.

but honestly, i have more general issues with my team in s+ than i do in s. it seems like everyone just goes straight for kills, and while yeah theyre important and i often end up w the most in the lobby, i dont just completely ignore the objective in the meantime. for example, being left to protect the zone against two people while the rest of my teammates chased after a charger close to their spawn.............

there have been more games that i can count that when i die, everything just goes wrong. we get the zone, i die, they get the zone, i take back the zone, i die, they take the zone............. like. where is my team when this is happening!! i guess thats always gonna be a problem though, unless youre good enough to basically just carry your team through every game then youre gonna have to trust that your team knows what theyre doing and they wont mess up.

and really, i feel like most of the time im either the one person who messes up or the one on the other team who just comes out of nowhere with the comeback in the last few seconds of the game