Squad/Clan War Organization and Standards?

[D3RK]

The amount of matches is important but something I have not seen anyone discuss yet is if players can switch weapons (and possibly gear) between games? You could end up bringing a setup that just isn't working out and need to switch in order to adapt to the opponents strategies. Stage and game mode bans could also be a thing. This would definitely give you a reason to change up your gear and weapon.

Some of my thoughts:
I think Bo5 is long enough to decide a winning team while quick enough to not get stale. Bo7 would also work for finals considering how quick matches are. We could stick to Turf Wars, but I think we should allow all game modes since it would add variety.

Game 1:
Each team bans game modes until there is 1 option. This is similar to picking a stage in the first round of a Smash set. We could also just dedicate a game mode to always be played in round 1 to keep it simple. Stage striking could be used or just have a set stage to go with the dedicated game mode.
Game 2+:
Losers pick game mode, Winners pick stage? Winners ban 1 stage and 1 game mode? Could do a lot of different things here honestly.
After stage + game mode select both teams adjust their load out and begin. Would probably need to set a timer on this (1-2 mins should be plenty)

 

[Deleted Member]

Considering its only a 4v4 and matches are very short, I'd say 7 matches is ideal for a Splatoon clan war.

 

[bluekentuckyboy]

I would like to see a system set up like this:

Best of 3 matches with 1 match = best of 5 rounds.

So example:
Team 1 sets gamemode/map for first match. Winner = best of 5 rounds
Team 2 sets gamemode/map for second match. Winner = best of 5 rounds

If each team wins one round, then a third (tiebreaker) round would be set up with a random (or voted) gamemode/map. Winner = Best of 5 rounds.

Winner of 2 matches wins the clan war.

-Weapons may only be changed between matches, not rounds.

 

[Kosaki]

Bo5 seems good enough.
The more time you have, the longer sets are meant to be, because players skills can only shine more on long runs.
Bo5 is probably the most convenient format for everyone.
Bo7 would be the way to go whenever possible though.

 

[Trieste Sp]

Bo57 is ideal but it may take far too much time. I believe Bo5 is the most suitable ruleset for tournament setting in my opinion.

 

[Langis]

Let's not mess with switching gamemodes, a team would practise one game mode and be skilled at it and it would be better if we only played one gamemode

 

[Dubs]

I'm all in for BO3 for normal matches - and then a BO5 for grand-finals/semi-final situations. I think that is a really good way to test the skill of teams. Plus having a BO5 finals puts a little more weight on those matches - and in theory those matches should be between the two best teams - so those will be very exciting to watch!

As far as voice chat solutions - I'm 100% against Skype. It has many vulnerabilities (like leaking your IP to people who add you as a friend) and also isn't very bandwidth efficient.

I think TeamSpeak, Mumble or Curse Voice is the way to go for voice chat. Honestly all three of those applications are solid solutions for online voice chat. And for in-person tournaments - well...you won't need voice chat. You're in person.

 

[Langis]

I'm all in for BO3 for normal matches - and then a BO5 for grand-finals/semi-final situations. I think that is a really good way to test the skill of teams. Plus having a BO5 finals puts a little more weight on those matches - and in theory those matches should be between the two best teams - so those will be very exciting to watch!

Please think of the organization needed for matches and the fact that one match is 3 minutes long. Bo3 would make a set at most 9 minutes. We need minimum Bo5, even though I think Bo7 is better since it's longer than the organization of the match and its pretty long as itself.

 

[Pusha]

Probably best of 5 or 7. And I'd suggest for non double elimination tournaments a best of 9 or 11 for semis and finals (although a double elimination bracket is pretty standard)

 

[Pusha]

Let's not mess with switching gamemodes, a team would practise one game mode and be skilled at it and it would be better if we only played one gamemode

We should be playing any game mode that we deem competitively viable. It's standard practice in shooters to have multiple gametypes in play, and have a standard rotation of maps for tournament rounds. In halo right now there are 5 different gametypes being played in tournaments. A team needs to be good at all of them to win, not just one. They play Team Slayer, Capture the Flag, Oddball, King of the Hill and Neutral Bomb (Assault). In black ops 2 they played CTF, Hardpoint (KoTH) and Search and Destroy. One gametype would be too stale.

 

[Dubs]

Please think of the organization needed for matches and the fact that one match is 3 minutes long. Bo3 would make a set at most 9 minutes. We need minimum Bo5, even though I think Bo7 is better since it's longer than the organization of the match and its pretty long as itself.

The thing is - what happens between matches? Will the teams pick/ban stages? Will they be changing out gear etc? Add that between each match and that's easily another 2 to 3 minutes per match - in addition to loading screens, menus and results. So while the match may only be 3 minutes - we'll probably have close to 4 minutes of in-between rounds and game screens. Making each match about 6 to 7 minutes. So the longest one set would be is 21 minutes. Anything longer than 30 minutes per set is too long on a larger scale. And I don't think playing more than 3 matches will really prove anything. Doing a best of 5 or 7 for each round is just too much. Grand finals/Semi-finals 5 or 7 would be great! But not for each round in a tournament.

I'm looking at this not just from a player perspective - but also an event organizer. I've been doing Smash tournaments and various other gaming tournaments for a WHILE! And I work for news - so I take the stream and entertainment value in high regard as well! BO5 and BO7 I don't think would play out very well for the players, the tournament or for the stream. It's too many matches that takes up too much time and I think have less strategy.

--Edit - Also - we're discussing things based on the little that we know about the game modes and options. So we should take all of this with a grain of salt.

 

[Pusha]

The thing is - what happens between matches? Will the teams pick/ban stages? Will they be changing out gear etc? Add that between each match and that's easily another 2 to 3 minutes per match - in addition to loading screens, menus and results. So while the match may only be 3 minutes - we'll probably have close to 4 minutes of in-between rounds and game screens. Making each match about 6 to 7 minutes. So the longest one set would be is 21 minutes. Anything longer than 30 minutes per set is too long on a larger scale. And I don't think playing more than 3 matches will really prove anything. Doing a best of 5 or 7 for each round is just too much. Grand finals/Semi-finals 5 or 7 would be great! But not for each round in a tournament.

I'm looking at this not just from a player perspective - but also an event organizer. I've been doing Smash tournaments and various other gaming tournaments for a WHILE! And I work for news - so I take the stream and entertainment value in high regard as well! BO5 and BO7 I don't think would play out very well for the players, the tournament or for the stream. It's too many matches that takes up too much time and I think have less strategy.

--Edit - Also - we're discussing things based on the little that we know about the game modes and options. So we should take all of this with a grain of salt.

Splatoon games are considerably shorter than regular shooters. 3 minutes for a game is nothing, and if we have a Bo3 set, that means sets could be over faster then 1 game would be played in other shooters. Smash is a very different game than splatoon and although i agree with you that we need to consider tournament organizers, Bo3 is just way too short.

 

[Kosaki]

We're talking Clan Wars which will mostly happen online without too much concerns on time limitations anyway. But playing with 8 players on a home console, chances are that some players might have trouble going through long sets for plenty of reasons.
Going Bo5 overall is a good balance to me, sets will take like 30-35 min at most in Turf Wars, including what happens between each game.
Bo7 would be 45-50min at most, but I think that whenever possible, that should be the way to go in order to get more accurate results in regards of players skills and adaptation ability, plus we naturally play more maps.
I don't think we should go any further than this, Bo7 is fair enough imo.

It might be off-topic, but IRL tournaments for Splatoon seems unlikely to me, or won't be that frequent. Running a Splatoon tourney on a week-end is likely to be a logistical nightmare.
But if it ever happens, I think we should go Bo5 double elimination during all the event. Bo3 is lame since games don't last long in any game modes, Splat Zones games which has a 5min limit can even end early, Bo7 eats way too much time.

 

[Fightersword]

Best of five for most official stuff. There can be more than one game mode used overall, so long as the same game mode is used for the entirety of one Best of set, though I do recommend doing mainly splat zones/tower (especially zones) and not turf war

there can of course be more war setups, in fact for just skirmishing around I feel leaving the number of best of rounds and the game types up to the teams to agree on, with a default in case they aren't able to reach an agreement, which would be the standard. For actual tournaments of course, there'd need to be a standard, and best of 5 should work nicely enough most of the time, as well as setting a standard game mode. The map will of course be decided by the team that lost the previous set, with some other arbitrary fair way to decide who gets to pick first, or having the first map be random or something.

It might be off-topic, but IRL tournaments for Splatoon seems unlikely to me, or won't be that frequent. Running a Splatoon tourney on a week-end is likely to be a logistical nightmare.
But if it ever happens, I think we should go Bo5 double elimination during all the event. Bo3 is lame since games don't last long in any game modes, Splat Zones games which has a 5min limit can even end early, Bo7 eats way too much time.

likely what will happen is leagues will be hosted mostly online, with all the weekly and monthly stuff happening through that, and a few big tournaments (invitationals?) can be done locally. A lot of big PC games do it this way, only gearing up for a huge LAN event for a few things. This is of course assuming the scene is significant.

 

[Pusha]

Best of five for most official stuff. There can be more than one game mode used overall, so long as the same game mode is used for the entirety of one Best of set, though I do recommend doing mainly splat zones/tower (especially zones) and not turf war

there can of course be more war setups, in fact for just skirmishing around I feel leaving the number of best of rounds and the game types up to the teams to agree on, with a default in case they aren't able to reach an agreement, which would be the standard. For actual tournaments of course, there'd need to be a standard, and best of 5 should work nicely enough most of the time, as well as setting a standard game mode. The map will of course be decided by the team that lost the previous set, with some other arbitrary fair way to decide who gets to pick first, or having the first map be random or something.




likely what will happen is leagues will be hosted mostly online, with all the weekly and monthly stuff happening through that, and a few big tournaments (invitationals?) can be done locally. A lot of big PC games do it this way, only gearing up for a huge LAN event for a few things. This is of course assuming the scene is significant.

Games should include not just one gametype but all game types that we deem competitively viable. If turf wars and splat zones are both viable then we could see something like splat zones for games 1, 3 and 5 and turf wars for games 2 and 4. If later after release the third gametype introduced is also viable them we can shake up the order to include it. Teams should need to be good at all gametypes, not just one. That's the model that most shooters follow in tournaments.

 

[Kosaki]

Wii U LAN parties though...
This didn't ever happen for Mario Kart iterations, which always had a significant online scene, and the lack of in-game voice chat is in that case a significant issue.

 

[Agosta44]

Wii U LAN parties though...
This didn't ever happen for Mario Kart iterations, which always had a significant online scene, and the lack of in-game voice chat is in that case a significant issue.

What is Skype

What is TeamSpeak

What is Mumble

What is Vent

All options competitive players would choose over shouting into a low quality mic on the gamepad.

 

[Kosaki]

Which would mean players need to bring their Wii U and PC, for a Splatoon 'LAN Party'. Skype mobile app is meh.
A tournament venue is generally noisy, a headset and a mic is needed.
In all seriousness, I can't picture this from happening.

 

[Pusha]

What is Skype

What is TeamSpeak

What is Mumble

What is Vent

All options competitive players would choose over shouting into a low quality mic on the gamepad.

You would use a headset, not the gamepad mic

 

[Nester]

Which would mean players need to bring their Wii U and PC, for a Splatoon 'LAN Party'. Skype mobile app is meh.
A tournament venue is generally noisy, a headset and a mic is needed.
In all seriousness, I can't picture this from happening.

Why would you need to bring your entire PC? Just to use a voice chat option in a local setting? All you need is a compatible HDMI monitor and your Wii U, and then if you need to hear the game audio you plug a set of earbuds or a headset into the Gamepad.

Besides, I've been to a ton of LAN competitions where everyone brings their giant PC setups. A Wii U LAN would be way easier to setup.

Assuming a LAN function is ever put in to the game, that is. Hoping it comes alongside the August update.