Walleye Warehouse has serious spawn camping issues

[The Apple BOOM]

I've been thinking about this after watching people play last night and playing a lot myself this morning. Walleye Warehouse is a bad stage betrayed by its simplicity.

The main problem here is that it is too easy to get stuck in a corner with no way out. This isn't a game about killing opponents, but covering the ground in ink (at least Turf War is that way). Sometimes you're going to slip up and get knocked back to your spawn. These things happen, especially with the randomness of playing with strangers. The problem is, in Walleye, you're forced to fight your way out. There are many different skill sets this game rewards, which is the beauty of it. You can be terrible at combat but still contribute immensely to the team by knowing where to be and what ink to cover. When you're spawn camped at Walleye, your skills in combat are the only thing that really matter.

Compare this to Saltspray Rig. There are 3 jumping off points if you're stuck at spawn in that stage. You're only going to be spawn camped by an immensely coordinated team on that stage, and even with coordination spawn camping is difficult due to the home team having the high ground advantage.

I understand that this is a competitive game and I shouldn't have scrub mentality, after all, I help run competitive fighting game tournaments in my area and I'm trying to get Splatoon in the events as well. The problem is that you need to not discourage newer players. You can't inundate them with hardcore harassment with no way out and force them to play a way that they are almost never forced to play in any other part of the game.

Walleye Warehouse is definitely the more simple stage, and it's meant as more of a starter stage compared to the more complex ones, but it's simple spawn point layout makes it so that it is incredibly easy to spawn camp. Spawn camping that is, in my opinion, more upsetting to the losers than fun to the winners.

 

[TheRapture]

I definitely agree. Walleye needs another spawn route to avoid this.

Great example:

 

[Ghoul02]

Unless your whole team gets wiped in a span of 5 seconds, you can always super jump to safety; there's a barrier in front of the spawn portal. If a whole team wipes and can't break through a blockade, that's an incredible blockade and a viable teams strategy.

 

[flc]

I definitely agree. Walleye needs another spawn route to avoid this.

Great example:

LMFAO FOUR ROLLERS

I mean yeah there's spawncamping on this map but holy hell orange team was asking for it

 

[Astral]

Then again the Bubbler is a good way to counteract spawn camping issues, i feel like people forget how useful it can be

 

[Agosta44]

+4 Rollers
+Never swam nor used specials nor bombs
+Contested opponents at spawn instead of super jumping
+Day 1 pubbies

That video is as cherry picked as the complaints against Rollers being overpowered. Wait until full release to talk about spawn camping against an invincible barrier.

 

[Lyn]

Not really, I'm fairly sure you can shoot from your spawn point and if your team is being spawn camped that just means they are wasting time not covering the map. :)

 

[DNE]

I think the reason rounds are a short 3 minutes is so that maps can actually encourage spawn camping as a strategy without being too oppressive for the losing team. If you get camped, you lost in the neutral hard enough to get pushed all the way back so you deserved it and no big deal because the round will be over soon; on to the next game. Personally, as long as the maps are symmetrical, so it isn't like their side of the map gave them the advantage or anything, I'm fine with that sort of design philosophy.

 

[ecaflip]

This is ultimately another case of poor base routes. If this map had another hallway out of each spawn or just another path (see Bay) this problem would be alleviated. It also helps that your base is completely protected so that you can toss all your sub weapons out and deter them from camping so hard. There are options to break the spawn camping, but there needs to be an alternate path prevent the door camping that will be prevalent upon release.

 

[Endymion]

Doesn't seem like the warehouse stage will be picked much. I can't wait for the mall stage.

 

[TheRapture]

Yeah, having four rollers kind of screws you over big team regardless of where you are lol

 

[Snowboar]

+4 Rollers
+Never swam nor used specials nor bombs
+Contested opponents at spawn instead of super jumping
+Day 1 pubbies

That video is as cherry picked as the complaints against Rollers being overpowered. Wait until full release to talk about spawn camping against an invincible barrier.

All my this.^
if you have 4 rollers you can forget getting anywhere near any objectives.

 

[Chapter Serf]

LMFAO FOUR ROLLERS

I mean yeah there's spawncamping on this map but holy hell orange team was asking for it

I have to agree. The other team WAS asking for it with FOUR ROLLERS. Now, granted the RNG did play a factor in the Testfire, but still.

 

[The Apple BOOM]

I have to agree. The other team WAS asking for it with FOUR ROLLERS. Now, granted the RNG did play a factor in the Testfire, but still.

As much as the 4 rollers was a thing, that's not the only time I have ever spawn camped someone. Here's another video.

They were all held off for a good while by just myself. If I had one other person with me it would have been much much worse. And even then, it held back their entire team while my other teammates were able to clean up the rest of the map.

 

[Citanul]

another potential fix is everyone gets a 5 second bubbler coming out of the spawn so you can deal with people just outside of spawn but not be able to squid jump somewhere and be invincible.

 

[Endymion]

This sounds like a plan.

 

[The Apple BOOM]

another potential fix is everyone gets a 5 second bubbler coming out of the spawn so you can deal with people just outside of spawn but not be able to squid jump somewhere and be invincible.

You can't design an entire map around not breaking if someone has a specific ability. Also, what if they don't have full meter?

 

[Citanul]

You can't design an entire map around not breaking if someone has a specific ability. Also, what if they don't have full meter?

I should've been more specific: I meant that people leaving spawn could basically have a Bubbler shield activated. For free. No matter what they have equipped or how much meter they have. Just something that would basically make them invincible for a short time leaving spawn so it would help combat spawn camping.

I don't mean to imply that people should always have a bubbler equipped and ready to go just for fighting against spawn camping. Just a game mechanic that discourages spawn camping.

 

[Agosta44]

I should've been more specific: I meant that people leaving spawn could basically have a Bubbler shield activated. For free. No matter what they have equipped or how much meter they have. Just something that would basically make them invincible for a short time leaving spawn so it would help combat spawn camping.

I don't mean to imply that people should always have a bubbler equipped and ready to go just for fighting against spawn camping. Just a game mechanic that discourages spawn camping.

There are multiple mechanics that discourage spawn camping. A protective barrier around the spawn point, as well as super jumping.

 

[Pivi]

As much as the 4 rollers was a thing, that's not the only time I have ever spawn camped someone. Here's another video.

They were all held off for a good while by just myself. If I had one other person with me it would have been much much worse. And even then, it held back their entire team while my other teammates were able to clean up the rest of the map.

Hmm, I agree with the other exit idea, but at the same time the solution to the spawncamp was seen in this video, did you see how fast you got taken care of when that Splattershot Jr. user threw the bomb at you?

I feel like any half decent player would be smart enough to use a bomb to cover themselves before hopping out of their spawn, as well as the fact that a Charger user could kill you without leaving.

Honestly I feel this will only be an issue in the demo where no one really knows what they're doing and there aren't enough weapons to take care of those situations.

EDIT actually wait

Those two platfoms are perfect for shooting and jumping off of, unless the person spawncamping is deliberately shooting up, their line of fire is going to be right down the middle slope

On the left side there's a box placed that can be shot and then jumped upon and squid..ed...across, getting you out of the danger area. Thiis is ALSO out of line of enemy fire, and there's no way they can focus on both these patches of land and you at the same time, even if there's more than one inkling harassing your spawn. The only way to cover that box in their ink is to either get on that platform (which would involve coming right in front of your spawn, turning around and shooting at it) or shoot towards the sky and have patches of ink land on it, which could easily get covered with your own ink.

Of course no one used them because it's day 1, hour 1 demo playtime, but I feel when people gain proper map awareness, this issue will disappear.