Weapon kits were designed for different game modes

[Sorcerer]

This has been my primary cause and belief since the days of Splatoon 2; and with Splatoon 3 still undergoing development, I've been seeing patterns regarding Subweapon and Special distribution amongst weapon kits.

Basically, you don't main a weapon kit, you main the whole *** weapon. You pick the kit according to the game mode currently active. This entails every weapon is meant for competitive play, even the humble Aerospray. This means every kit has a use, even the vanilla Carbon Roller. I've been writing Anarchy guides (link in my signature) where I state which kit should be brought to which game mode and why. These guides don't get a lot of traction and my overall theory absolutely has not been accepted. It fact it's been widely mocked and derided but I keep writing because there are things you notice once you go down that rabbit hole.

Once you believe each kit applies to two modes out of four, mathematically you realize there are only 6 possible combinations present. Mapping for every weapon, I discovered that every primary kit sharing a same special has a different combination of game modes in which they excel. This follows for every secondary kit sharing a same special. For subweapons, the combinations of preferred game modes do not repeat themselves more than twice for every weapon kit sharing the same sub. And whenever a new special has come out, the two sets to come out with it have mirroring combinations.

I can make some lowkey predictions with the following theory. Of the four upcoming datamined weapons, they will not have Tacticooler or Ink Vac in the primary slot, because we have 6 primary weapon kits with these specials already. I can eliminate the probability of certain future weapon kits; for example I can process by elimination that Heavy Edit Splatling was designed for Rainmaker and Clam Blitz because every other combinations for primary weapons with Tacticooler has been taken. I can therefore eliminate Suction Bomb, Torpedo, Splash Wall and Point Sensor from the list of possible subweapons that would be given to the alternate kit because the Splat Zones-Tower Control combinations have been used twice there already.

I've shared this theory on Reddit and Gamefaqs and never found anyone willing to agree, which is a tragedy all if its own. Basically, the lack of people trying out "weak kits" prevents a theory that looks good when seen at a small scale, to be accepted at large scale. Thanks for reading.

 

[SquidAbortions]

oh okay.

 

[plantknowsyourlocation]

I think this is how things can end up being, and it's cool when kits happen to cater to different modes and bring a weapon that would otherwise be weak there into a spot where they can reasonably be played, regardless of the main's weaknesses to the mode. I agree that some weapon kits are underexplored because they don't work in most modes, even if they may have a niche somewhere in a specific mode. I'm not totally convinced this is an accurate method of prediction, and that it's being distributed this way intentionally. I'd need a further explanation to understand where you're coming from.

 

[kyubone]

i've certainly felt this way about how vheavy/heavy deco complement each other so i think there's merit to this idea. i enjoy playing a weapon's different kits in different modes (though some are just flat-out better in most maps & modes which is where the theory may need some adjustment), so i'm curious to see if anyone else has had similar experiences

that said, i'm neither sure that the predictive model is sound nor confident that it's very useful for the majority of players. the devs have their own ideas of what a weapon "needs" in its kit - or they might not; i'm not a mind reader and it's important to consider every possibility, including the one where nobody has a plan and everything is chaos - and while i don't think you're doing anything wrong, it can be easy to get lost in the weeds when you focus too much on figuring out the system behind how kits are designed instead of appreciating the game for what it is.

it'll be interesting to see how this develops over time when the next batch of kits drops in fresh season 24

 

[Sorcerer]

@plantknowsyourlocation
It's a theory that works at the small scale, that I have trouble convincing others at the large scale. Many weapons are universally recognized as having better modes with certain kits. Pika is a pro bloblobber player that shows the difference between the two sets here, in different game modes:

I apply this to EVERY weapon. Once you start mapping out which weapon kits work best in each game modes, then the patterns emerge. Set prediction is only an offshot of this theory, and it's not perfect because it only eliminates possible outcomes

 

[plantknowsyourlocation]

@plantknowsyourlocation
It's a theory that works at the small scale, that I have trouble convincing others at the large scale. Many weapons are universally recognized as having better modes with certain kits. Pika is a pro bloblobber player that shows the difference between the two sets here, in different game modes:

I apply this to EVERY weapon. Once you start mapping out which weapon kits work best in each game modes, then the patterns emerge. Set prediction is only an offshot of this theory, and it's not perfect because it only eliminates possible outcomes

I may pick different dynamo kits for different modes. Gold feels a lot better on some zones maps. I get the concept. I just don't think that your idea that EVERY kit fits this mold holds up. I feel more like weapon kits cater to different playstyles, and different playstyles happen to have more value in some modes. Stationary or painting kits tend to work better in zones, meanwhile that same weapon may get a kit made to cater to people who like a more aggressive playstyle, which might happen to have more value in a mode like clams or rm. And sometimes kits can get used for other reasons. Map niches, certain matchups, etc. I struggle to see what mode something like, say, vnova was specifically made for, and how anova is only useful over it in a set few modes.

 

[RubberCF]

@plantknowsyourlocation
It's a theory that works at the small scale, that I have trouble convincing others at the large scale. Many weapons are universally recognized as having better modes with certain kits. Pika is a pro bloblobber player that shows the difference between the two sets here, in different game modes:

I apply this to EVERY weapon. Once you start mapping out which weapon kits work best in each game modes, then the patterns emerge. Set prediction is only an offshot of this theory, and it's not perfect because it only eliminates possible outcomes

The theory is a nice idea but the issue is that in practice, often a kit having better synergy with a certain mode isnt enough to make up for its overall lack of effectiveness. For example, vbrellas kit is sprinkler tristrike. Sbrella is auto inkjet. Sprinkler and inkstrike are both particularly better in zones, but thats still not enough to make up for how autobomb inkjet is just overall way better, both in terms of balance and synergy with the main weapon.
Like im all about finding the unique strengths/niche of less used weapons and such, but if you mean to imply that every kit has a mode where its better than its variant, i cant say i agree, and i dont see why it would necessarily be the case.

 

[Sorcerer]

You can't pick a weapon kit for certain maps because maps are randomly chosen between two. "Playstyle" is just game objective under a different name. But different playstyles don't have more or less value: it's the weapon role that has value, and the kit that expresses the weapon's role in each game mode.

I actually wrote about Nova! Made a guide and everything! Basically, vNova likes to prevent flankers in game modes where flankers can create a huge takeover very quickly. aNova tries to put damage on the field to hasten eliminations and prevent individuals from advancing. Essentially, if you think SOME weapons work best in some modes, you start wondering if that's the case for ALL weapons, and play to see how the kit benefits the situation.

 

[kyubone]

I feel more like weapon kits cater to different playstyles, and different playstyles happen to have more value in some modes. Stationary or painting kits tend to work better in zones, meanwhile that same weapon may get a kit made to cater to people who like a more aggressive playstyle, which might happen to have more value in a mode like clams or rm. And sometimes kits can get used for other reasons. Map niches, certain matchups, etc. I struggle to see what mode something like, say, vnova was specifically made for, and how anova is only useful over it in a set few modes.

this sums up my thoughts on the matter quite nicely, so i'd say extrapolating a theory that works quite well for a few weapons with good kit variety to the entire game is naturally going to be troublesome.

op, it may be worth considering that the intent of the devs (if that's what you care about and it sounds like it is but please correct me if i'm misinterpreting) is not to design kits for specific modes, but simply for specific playstyles. their performance in different modes is likely a symptom of that design philosophy and not the main reason they were created. i hope i was able to put that in a respectful tone cuz i do think there's some merit to this discussion

You can't pick a weapon kit for certain maps because maps are randomly chosen between two. "Playstyle" is just game objective under a different name. But different playstyles don't have more or less value: it's the weapon role that has value, and the kit that expresses the weapon's role in each game mode.

so this is purely from a soloq perspective? as a comp player it's the exact opposite because maplists and counterpicks mean you can absolutely control which maps you're playing on, which will have an impact on what you prefer to play. help me understand!

 

[Sorcerer]

The theory is a nice idea but the issue is that in practice, often a kit having better synergy with a certain mode isnt enough to make up for its overall lack of effectiveness. For example, vbrellas kit is sprinkler tristrike. Sbrella is auto inkjet. Sprinkler and inkstrike are both particularly better in zones, but thats still not enough to make up for how autobomb inkjet is just overall way better, both in terms of balance and synergy with the main weapon

Buy can we agree that for an overall Splat Brella main that has to face Splat Zones, the vanilla kit is better for them than the Sorella kit? Because having a Sprinkler focus opponents on it is better than chasing evasive turf support with an Autobomb? Said Autobomb being much easier to avoid by the nimble turf support unit that builds tons of space as it travels? For the objective of winning Splat Zones with a Splat Brella, the vanilla kit is more conductive to the task than the Sorella kit.

 

[Yosi Spring]

It's a good theory, and I'll be interested in seeing if your predictions are right. But why do you care if other people believe the theory or not? Even if you're correct, people will still play the weapons they personally believe to be more effective/fun. Doesn't make sense to play Splat Brella in zones "because the devs intended it" if you're getting more wins or having more fun with Sorella Brella in zones.

 

[plantknowsyourlocation]

You can't pick a weapon kit for certain maps because maps are randomly chosen between two. "Playstyle" is just game objective under a different name. But different playstyles don't have more or less value: it's the weapon role that has value, and the kit that expresses the weapon's role in each game mode.

I actually wrote about Nova! Made a guide and everything! Basically, vNova likes to prevent flankers in game modes where flankers can create a huge takeover very quickly. aNova tries to put damage on the field to hasten eliminations and prevent individuals from advancing. Essentially, if you think SOME weapons work best in some modes, you start wondering if that's the case for ALL weapons, and play to see how the kit benefits the situation.

you dont seem very open to criticism

Buy can we agree that for an overall Splat Brella main that has to face Splat Zones, the vanilla kit is better for them than the Sorella kit? Because having a Sprinkler focus opponents on it is better than chasing evasive turf support with an Autobomb? Said Autobomb being much easier to avoid by the nimble turf support unit that builds tons of space as it travels? For the objective of winning Splat Zones with a Splat Brella, the vanilla kit is more conductive to the task than the Sorella kit.

even in zones there is no reason why one would ever use the vanilla over the sorella. it seems like you're also leaving out that inkjet is one of the best retake specials in a gamemode that revolves around the retake.

 

[vitellary]

yeah, the problem with the vanilla brella is that "better paint than sorella" is really the only benefit it has, and the fighting power of the sorella kit is just way more valuable than paint. that's like, splatoon 101, paint isn't everything for a kit to be good

 

[missingno]

There are certainly some cases where a kit is better for certain mapmodes. But I don't think this can be universally applied to every weapon, nor do I think it's correct to only think in terms of mode and not mapmode. More often I'd say kits are designed around roles, and that often depends on the comp more than it depends on the mode.

And then of course you have all the trash kits that are just universally outclassed by their alternative. In what mode would I want to play S-Blast 92 over 91? When is Neo Clash ever better than vClash? vRapid over Rapid Deco? Brush Nouveau over vBrush? vCarbon over Deco? And no, I don't think vBrella has any good reason to be picked over Sorella either.

 

[Sorcerer]

so this is purely from a soloq perspective? as a comp player it's the exact opposite because maplists and counterpicks mean you can absolutely control which maps you're playing on, which will have an impact on what you prefer to play. help me understand!

This is only SoloQ if you think map design is more important than individual game objectives. From a weapon design perspective, it would absolutely be made for SoloQ. Saying comp is the exact opposite of soloQ irks me because then all competition becomes meta counterplay rather than mastery of the individual weapon.

Because individual weapons are valued more than others, their kits are valued in specific game modes because at that level of play, all minor changes matter. For weapons like the previously mentioned Nova, well even aNova doesn't see much competitive play, so it is assumed vNova has even less value. But if you dedicated yourself to Nova as much as to any high tier weapon, you'd see the kit has importance for the purpose of flexing weapon roles. That killer Wail is obviously more useful to it in Tower Control than in Clam Blitz (for instance), where turf control and individual kills are required.

 

[RubberCF]

Buy can we agree that for an overall Splat Brella main that has to face Splat Zones, the vanilla kit is better for them than the Sorella kit? Because having a Sprinkler focus opponents on it is better than chasing evasive turf support with an Autobomb? Said Autobomb being much easier to avoid by the nimble turf support unit that builds tons of space as it travels? For the objective of winning Splat Zones with a Splat Brella, the vanilla kit is more conductive to the task than the Sorella kit.

My point was that even though its more synergistic with zones as a mode, the sorella kit is still the better choice. Im not going to like get super into why that is outside just saying that while tristrike is good inkjet is great and works better with brella as a main, and while sprinkler has its uses in zones auto by virtue of being a lethal sub that can make people move is significantly better overall, and it also has more synergy with the main weapon of brella.
But even if you were right and vbrella was a better pick for zones, my overall point is that your idea that each set of kits always has a use for each depending on mode is nit necessarily true. A kits synergy with a mode is not the only metric to use when deciding what to pick, its possible for a kit to have more synergy with a mode, but still be a worse option bc the other kit is so much better as a whole. Reefslider has a zones niche bc it can cap zone easily, but id still prefer zooka or inkjet or cooler any day bc even though they dont have particular synergy with zones, they are just way better overall.

 

[Sorcerer]

yeah, the problem with the vanilla brella is that "better paint than sorella" is really the only benefit it has, and the fighting power of the sorella kit is just way more valuable than paint. that's like, splatoon 101, paint isn't everything for a kit to be good

It's not just about better paint, it's about creating a focus point for others to see, from there you can better get into people's face and pop brella. The enemies you wish dead in Splat Zones won't see Autobomb as a viable threat. In fact, even in the modes where Brella wants Autobomb, it uses them to shake a static board state within the enemy side of the map. How do you get in people's face as brella? Use your subweapon. But sometimes you wanna attract people, sometimes you want to cause a distraction because they're so focused. This changes by game mode, because the mode dictates the weapon role

 

[RubberCF]

My point was that even though its more synergistic with zones as a mode, the sorella kit is still the better choice. Im not going to like get super into why that is outside just saying that while tristrike is good inkjet is great and works better with brella as a main, and while sprinkler has its uses in zones auto by virtue of being a lethal sub that can make people move is significantly better overall, and it also has more synergy with the main weapon of brella.
But even if you were right and vbrella was a better pick for zones, my overall point is that your idea that each set of kits always has a use for each depending on mode is nit necessarily true. A kits synergy with a mode is not the only metric to use when deciding what to pick, its possible for a kit to have more synergy with a mode, but still be a worse option bc the other kit is so much better as a whole. Reefslider has a zones niche bc it can cap zone easily, but id still prefer zooka or inkjet or cooler any day bc even though they dont have particular synergy with zones, they are just way better overall.

Though, if ive misinterpreted what your idea is my bad. Idk if you meant to imply what i said or are just trying to say that we should look at whar "bad" weapons have to offer more, even if they still remain not great

 

[Sorcerer]

It's a good theory, and I'll be interested in seeing if your predictions are right. But why do you care if other people believe the theory or not? Even if you're correct, people will still play the weapons they personally believe to be more effective/fun. Doesn't make sense to play Splat Brella in zones "because the devs intended it" if you're getting more wins or having more fun with Sorella Brella in zones.

Well for starters because then I'd have people crosschecking me to see if I'm not doing any glaring errors. I mean, the whole Bloblobber thing came by because of an error on my end. But more to the point, by understanding which kit goes in which mode, you understand the root role of the weapon.

 

[Yosi Spring]

In fact, even in the modes where Brella wants Autobomb, it uses them to shake a static board state within the enemy side of the map.

Have you considered using Autobomb to detect sharkers? It's pretty common for the enemy team to hide on your side of the map after they get a wipe in Splat Zones. Sprinkler is much less likely to force a player out of hiding than an Autobomb.