Ink or Sink Tournament! v.1.1b Final Version!

[GameGalaxy64]

Can any of you link footage of competitive play taking place on SR:RM?

 

[Kbot]

I'm uncomfortable banning any maps at this point in time. I think it's a very unhealthy habit that we don't want to get into. There's nothing stopping any of the maps from being competitive (except perhaps stalling on SS RM, but we can just make that illegal. it's very easy to tell when a team is stalling and when they aren't), so we shouldn't get into the habit of banning any of them.

It's a discussion that we have to have at one point. There's going to be things like SS RM and BB RM that we might have to ban. Stalling isn't going to get us anywhere. It'll draw out matches, be boring to watch, and will be a really cheap strat. But, there's nothing stopping anyone from doing it.

 

[GameGalaxy64]

It's a discussion that we have to have at one point. There's going to be things like SS RM and BB RM that we might have to ban. Stalling isn't going to get us anywhere. It'll draw out matches, be boring to watch, and will be a really cheap strat. But, there's nothing stopping anyone from doing it.

I say we hold off on this decision until it becomes a SERIOUS problem that's really messing up tournaments and SCL rankings. I understand how cheap of a strat it is and everything, but i think we should give it a month or two.

 

[Power]

It is great to discuss things and have something to look out for. But before we make a decision (obviously, turf is done imo) we should keep on testing it. I remember flc said in the IoS leader chat that we need to play maps (Rainmaker) more before we make a decision on bans, (as there may be a way to counter these game breaking situations mentioned). I agree with his statement and feel that these problems would have to be widely agreed upon when it affects important matches. (Lets just hope it doesn't happen in a match such as winners final of a big tourney.) Discussion is great though, I am only advocating for the prevention of a rushed decision.

 

[Kbot]

I say we hold off on this decision until it becomes a SERIOUS problem that's really messing up tournaments and SCL rankings. I understand how cheap of a strat it is and everything, but i think we should give it a month or two.

I'm only using this as an example. I'm saying that overall we have to look at banning certain gametypes sooner rather than later. Even things that are decent but are not suited for competitive play in general we might have to wind up banning.

I'm not saying let's get ban happy, I'm saying let's start the discussion on maps to watch. Blackbelly and Saltspray being 2 of a few.

 

[WydrA]

Too much ban talk for my liking, it's still early days.

Some things are so obviously broken they should be banned straight off the bat (not saying the things suggested are necessarily in that category).

The only map I would propose banning is Camp triggerfish for turf wars only. It's almost completely random and leaves little to no room for proper strategizing. Also boring to watch...
But I definitely wouldn't ban any of the presented game modes this early on.

 

[Aweshucks]

Yes, we should take a look at them and see if it becomes a problem, but we need to thing long and hard about banning. Like, months of suspect testing before we can even discuss actually banning maps. If there was something obviously and immediately uncompetitive about a map (i.e. unsymmetrical to the point where it gives a distinct advantage to a random team), we shouldn't talk about bans right now.

Edit: And if stalling on SS RM is such a problem (I'm not entirely convinced it is, but I haven't seen too much play on that map and don't want to have a position either way), then the fix should not be banning the map/gamemode outright, but instead putting a clause in the rules that says "teams may not carry the rainmaker past the top of the ramp that separates the northernmost section of the map from the middle portion of the map" (for example. Obviously needs better wording). Because that's a very easy thing to do and very easy to detect.

 

[GameGalaxy64]

I'm only using this as an example. I'm saying that overall we have to look at banning certain gametypes sooner rather than later. Even things that are decent but are not suited for competitive play in general we might have to wind up banning.

I'm not saying let's get ban happy, I'm saying let's start the discussion on maps to watch. Blackbelly and Saltspray being 2 of a few.

I only agree with "sooner rather than later" if we have a plethora of evidence in a lot of competitive matches favoring that ban. In fact, I'm all for it if we can compile the data quickly. Besides Imperious Lounge, are there any other squads testing these things out? I say this is top priority.

 

[Power]

Well, I have started a sort of testing group within a skype chat that I am a part of. I do not think we work as much as the lounge, definitely hoping to get more people involved though, as we were testing rainmaker on blackbelly yesterday.

I only agree with "sooner rather than later" if we have a plethora of evidence in a lot of competitive matches favoring that ban. In fact, I'm all for it if we can compile the data quickly. Besides Imperious Lounge, are there any other squads testing these things out? I say this is top priority.

 

[Aweshucks]

I'm glad that you're testing things on your own, but this should be something we (all of us that are very active within the community and who care about the future of the game) should be discussing together.

 

[GameGalaxy64]

Well, I have started a sort of testing group within a skype chat that I am a part of. I do not think we work as much as the lounge, definitely hoping to get more people involved though, as we were testing rainmaker on blackbelly yesterday.

That's good to hear. Have you came to any other conclusions with different map/mode conundrums? I heard FH:RM is also a problem, is that true?

 

[Power]

I'm glad that you're testing things on your own, but this should be something we (all of us that are very active within the community and who care about the future of the game) should be discussing together.

That's good to hear. Have you came to any other conclusions with different map/mode conundrums? I heard FH:RM is also a problem, is that true?

Well we just started (yesterday night) and didn't have much to report back other than spammable specials and subs in blackbelly, which I am sure most of you are aware of. I also heard from the other people in the chat that Flounder heights is a problem, but we had not gotten to discussing it yet. We focused on blackbelly.
If anybody wants in, just give the word.

 

[DaisyFan]

Too much ban talk for my liking, it's still early days.

There people want and dont want, but overall finales shouldn't have the option of TW overall too.

 

[Power]

There people want and dont want, but overall finales shouldn't have the option of TW overall too.

I think we can all agree on that... I hope...

 

[Aweshucks]

Yeah, we've had three months to determine that turf wars is not competitively viable, and very few people disagree with that.

 

[Typhlosion09]

Yeah, we've had three months to determine that turf wars is not competitively viable, and very few people disagree with that.

I just think the problem is every map, weapons, etc. were designed with turf war in mind. That's why there isn't one flat out horrible turf war stage, but Blackbelly RM and Arowana SZ are generally hated for those specific modes. Although otherwise yes, turf is the least competitive mode.

 

[Aweshucks]

there's no evidence that that's true. I mean, the maps are even changed for different moves

 

[CutestFish]

Uhhh I don't know if everyone was satisfied with the Salty Splatoon Ruleset. I suggest creating a poll regarding that. BTW, did you notice that out of the 24 matches played, there was only three matches that were not clean sweeps?

I actually didn't post the scores but any but the top 4 games namely because I didn't see them. I haven't really met anyone that truly disliked that system but I'd appreciate if people spoke up if they do.

 

[Agosta44]

None of those maps have an issue like Saltspray does. North is completely closed off except for the single chokepoint with lots of containers to hide behind. It's a stalling haven/nightmare.

You can create chokeholds on every map. Some are more difficult to defend than others but some are much easier than SS. Walleye is also more broken than Salt Spray is.

 

[GameGalaxy64]

You can create chokeholds on every map. Some are more difficult to defend than others but some are much easier than SS. Walleye is also more broken than Salt Spray is.

Hmm, I hope these don't probe much of a problem? Testing anyone?