Rebalancing All Rollers

[youre_a_squib_now]

I'm going to take a wild guess here from all these balance threads that OPW has been making and just assume he has an issue with how the developers balance their game. I'm also going to further assume that he thinks that they don't know what they're doing and that he can do their job better than they can. This isn't an argument for anything for or against, but at this point I'm going to make a statement, because it just seems obvious at this point.

yes I'm pretty sure this is obvious. We've already established that you don't agree, so I don't see any use continuing to point it out.

 

[McSquid82]

Back on topic, rollers are already balanced. At the start of this game's life cycle they all suffered from bad hitboxes, especially on their horizontal flicks. I'm not saying make them like they were on launch in S1, but the changes they've made have been good for the class. Every class has a different role, and rollers just happen to have the sneaking and sharking. Lastly, this is the competitive discussion page, so I have something else relevant to that particular topic to say. Let the meta develop and let the developers do their job. If something becomes a problem and starts to overwhelmingly dominate in X power or the competitive scene, it will be fixed.

 

[OnePotWonder]

If something becomes a problem and starts to overwhelmingly dominate in X power or the competitive scene, it will be fixed.

.52 Gal casually dominating X Rank with zero nerfs:


We hear your opinion, but that's all it is: An opinion. Rollers' hitboxes did need the buffs the class generally received, but those were width-based hitbox buffs. My nerfs are length-based, an area where I think rollers could be toned back. Most rollers heavily over-rely on their one-shot horizontal flicks and never fight at any distance. The two sharking rollers feel incredibly one-note, and Dynamo and Flingza are barely an improvement since they ultimately fight the exact same. Big Swig is the only one that feels truly interesting. Hence why I want more rollers to be like it.

The goal isn't to flatly nerf rollers. The goal is to turn them from one-trick-sharkies into scrappy generalists.

Maybe some maximum range buffs are in order... or maybe flick speed buffs? I'm going to have to do some research.
Edit: Unfortunately, Inkipedia doesn't have maximum range statistics listed for rollers; only the range where minimum damage is dealt.

 

[QuagSass]

Maybe some maximum range buffs are in order... or maybe flick speed buffs? I'm going to have to do some research.

I honestly was kinda expecting to see some flick speed changes. At least for Dynamo's vertical. Big reason why you dont see Dynamos using it much isn't because it's bad per se, but because it takes like two decades to do a vertical flick. Doing a Dynamo vertical feels more like a punishment than a part of the weapon's toolkit.

 

[youre_a_squib_now]

Back on topic, rollers are already balanced. At the start of this game's life cycle they all suffered from bad hitboxes, especially on their horizontal flicks. I'm not saying make them like they were on launch in S1, but the changes they've made have been good for the class. Every class has a different role, and rollers just happen to have the sneaking and sharking.

I agree here.

Lastly, this is the competitive discussion page, so I have something else relevant to that particular topic to say. Let the meta develop and let the developers do their job. If something becomes a problem and starts to overwhelmingly dominate in X power or the competitive scene, it will be fixed.

I don't think anyone is saying that we're trying to actually replace the developer's decisions here. That's not going to happen.

 

[youre_a_squib_now]

I honestly was kinda expecting to see some flick speed changes. At least for Dynamo's vertical. Big reason why you dont see Dynamos using it much isn't because it's bad per se, but because it takes like two decades to do a vertical flick. Doing a Dynamo vertical feels more like a punishment than a part of the weapon's toolkit.

I fully agree. I would not be the first to suggest removing Dynamo's vertical entirely as a better buff for it.

 

[Cephalobro]

@OnePotWonder and @McSquid82 don't start a heated argument or this thread is gonna get deleted.

 

[OnePotWonder]

@OnePotWonder and @McSquid82 don't start a heated argument or this thread is gonna get deleted.

You say that like there’s still risk of that happening. Even if there was, Squid has already relegated the argument to a DM conversation this time around, which I will say I’m thankful for.

Also, there should exist an option to lock a thread if discussion is getting out of hand, preventing further comments but keeping the thread intact. Which seems like a much more reasonable solution, if you ask me.

 

[Algae]

I fully agree. I would not be the first to suggest removing Dynamo's vertical entirely as a better buff for it.

Ooh airborne faster dynamo flick! Such an apparent retool would be fun! Current vertical flick makes the weapon too much of a flick-aim-intensive zoner, but horizontal better plays into rollers' sneaky gameplay, despite only having v.slosher range

 

[McSquid82]

I know it's been a while since I last posted on here, but here's what I hope is a simple, non-controversial take on this topic. If you really want to rebalance rollers like this topic says, maybe another way to do it would be to incentivize rolling. For all its issues, the Big Swig seems to be the only roller that you actually want to roll with more often than not because of its insane ink efficiency and coverage. I know they already made it so that the faster you roll the more ink efficient the roller is, but is there anything more they can do?