Squad Composition Meta

[Ranias]

So what do you all think the best team comp will be?

It seems to me that in Turf War, at least one Roller is needed as a frontlinesman and to help with painting quickly and uniformly.

I personally think the best team composition would be something like:
2 Rollers, a Charger, and a Jr.
or
2 Rollers and 2 Splattershots

If everyone gets good with anti-Roller subweapons, or if they nerf Rollers, then the best team comp might be only one Roller.

 

[WydrA]

Hmm this is something that's hard to theorize without knowing all the gear and weapons and their effects, but I think roles are more important than weapons. Kind of like in TF2. Only one I can actually think of right now is support, which would use long range sniper weapons.

 

[Ranias]

Yeah, maybe like 2 frontlines, an assault, and a support.

Just remembered that the Brush will be a thing too. A less supporty and more offensive Roller?

 

[Dirty Duck]

I dominated with and was dominated by all sorts of team compositions today, so it's kind of hard to tell. At least one roller is essential though, in games that will play like Testfire did. Obviously the new gear and modes will mean that there won't be all that many games that play like Testfire.

 

[GamingWarthog]

Yeah, maybe like 2 frontlines, an assault, and a support.

Just remembered that the Brush will be a thing too. A less supporty and more offensive Roller?

The Brush seems like it could be either a rush down or support weapon to me depending on what subweapon/special combos it has access to. Its superior speed makes it good for backdooring or getting to an important spot first to give your team access to superior positioning (like the top of the crates in the middle of Walleye Warehouse).

 

[WydrA]

The Brush seems like it could be either a rush down or support weapon to me depending on what subweapon/special combos it has access to. Its superior speed makes it good for backdooring or getting to an important spot first to give your team access to superior positioning (like the top of the crates in the middle of Walleye Warehouse).

Really? How do you see it being good as support?If it's anything like the roller I would think it would be pretty bad for support.

 

[GamingWarthog]

Really? How do you see it being good as support?If it's anything like the roller I would think it would be pretty bad for support.

The Brush can set up ink trails for teammates and could potentially move fast enough that they don't need to stay behind to let the Brush get ahead. Basically a support Brush user would run around the map making sure the rest of his team can do the same in squid form, as well as letting them super jump to his location. Instead of backing up one teammate in particular the support Brush runs around making sure the entire time to go where they want to, plus if combined with the shield special a Brush could quickly spread it to the entire time, or rush to a spot and thrown down a beacon. Of course this is all speculation, we also need to see how fast it actually is and what sub/special combos it gets, if it only has stuff like the bombs or killer whale supporting with the Brush will be much harder.

 

[Azure J]

I'm not sure about full teams, but I feel like chargers are going to become immensely valuable to teams with multiple rollers or a roller and a paintbrush, especially if they are good about awareness and can generate paths linking large swaths of the turf together quickly.

 

[Ranias]

Well, I guess support is kind of a broad term to use. The Brush seems best suited for speed and flanking, sort of like the Team Fortress 2 Scout.

I think essentially what each team needs is:
Someone to spread ink quickly and uniformly (Roller)
Someone to ink walls quickly (Splattershot or Splattershot Jr.)
A mid/long range squid to focus on kills (Charger or Splattershot)
A speedy/stealthy squid to flank and rush objectives (Brush or Splattershot Jr.)

 

[WydrA]

The Brush can set up ink trails for teammates and could potentially move fast enough that they don't need to stay behind to let the Brush get ahead. Basically a support Brush user would run around the map making sure the rest of his team can do the same in squid form, as well as letting them super jump to his location. Instead of backing up one teammate in particular the support Brush runs around making sure the entire time to go where they want to, plus if combined with the shield special a Brush could quickly spread it to the entire time, or rush to a spot and thrown down a beacon. Of course this is all speculation, we also need to see how fast it actually is and what sub/special combos it gets, if it only has stuff like the bombs or killer whale supporting with the Brush will be much harder.

But is there really much point to ink trails when the people without them are splatter hopping/dashing ahead of you?
But that beacon thing is useful. made me think, roller/brush might make a good tank. If you can deck out with a shield and maybe get better health it could make a great creeping barrage of ink.

 

[LittlestMinish]

I agree Wyrda, it appears to be much more "role based" For Turf War, I would say it needs to be broken down like this:

Saltspray Rig - This map has some required tactics, otherwise you'll look at the map at the end and you'll see either the North or South was completely ignored.

• Charger - This guys needs to dominate the northern point. There is an excellent tower of boxes that gives the basic charger perfect range to cover the entire North platform. You can hold south box all day long but if they have 80% of north, that's like 12-15 percent total, and that's game. The problem with that is that it is harder for a charger user to get through center thoroughfare up to the north platform. That' what the next character is for.
• Roller 1 - This character is for covering and contesting most of the central thoroughfare and contesting the general central area of the map,
• Roller 2 - I'd say that two rollers is most effective on this map, mostly because the southern half of the map has causeways that are literally the perfect size for a roller to be able to cover about half of the map in less than 20 seconds. The team is probably set with this set up. This player will cover south and the corridors by it.
• Splatter - I think this is the havoc character for this level, helping cover North and South, given they are the more important and more defensible parts of the level.

Walleye Warehouse - This one is much more of a free-for-all, but a optimal team comp is preferred. Charger just isn't great for this map because the only real safe spot to snipe can't reach the middle of the map, and the box in front of that barely reaches the median. At best its a defensive setup, but it can be ganked by someone going up the right flank.

• Roller 1 - The thing I see often is that people forget to take their left flank up top, because that's probably the least likely to be recovered, plus its like 2% of the map. I can't tell you how often I saw that corridor completely bare at the end of the match.
• Roller 2 or Artist (Brusher) - Depending how fast the paintbrush is (I'm assuming very quick), they will be best at running up the left side corridor of the opponent and causing havoc in the base. If that proves t not be optimal, then another paintbrush doing the same thing.
• Splatter 1 & 2 - Playing the game like normal in the center and the right and left alcove.

This is what I've picked up from the Beta and in no way reflects item and loadout choices. Thoughts?

 

[GamingWarthog]

Well, I guess support is kind of a broad term to use. The Brush seems best suited for speed and flanking, sort of like the Team Fortress 2 Scout.

I think essentially what each team needs is:
Someone to spread ink quickly and uniformly (Roller)
Someone to ink walls quickly (Splattershot or Splattershot Jr.)
A mid/long range squid to focus on kills (Charger or Splattershot)
A speedy/stealthy squid to flank and rush objectives (Brush or Splattershot Jr.)

That sounds like a good set up. I was thinking of Smite when I referred to the Brush as a support, since in Smite supports are expected to roam once the carry is strong enough to farm for himself. We'll see how the Brush turns out once it comes out.

 

[FunkyLobster]

in my mind i think the most realistically effective setup is 3 shooter type weapons and a splat roller

2 people with splattershot type weapons on the front line coordinating with each other directly and covering the main area, and the splat roller on the flanks doing most the territory coverage. one player in between the duo and the roller with an versatile role; protect the roller, and come up to the firefight if things get out of hand

splattershots are VERY strong in this game because of their adaptability. since its just 4v4, weapons that are only strong in a niche like chargers aren't going to be very strong because unless your team compensates for that role perfectly, you're effectively turning the game into a 3v4. this is why classes like the sniper and spy aren't picked at all in competitive 6v6 in tf2; they're good classes, sure, but you have better choices that can get the same job done more simply and effectively with this small player count.

rollers are very interesting, probably my favorite weapon, even though i'd never pick it. you sacrifice a lot of mobility (you can't flick ink far enough ahead of you to squid up and save time, or even splatterhop) and range for ink coverage. since it's so close range you don't stand a chance against people directly in front of you; you have to flank them. stay out of their peripheral view and get behind them. that's the safest way to secure a frag. and because it impedes your mobility, you're going to have to rely on your team to make it to choke points before you, where they have better weapons suited for the job. this is where my competitive composition comes into play:

you have a duo with incredible adaptable roles that can take the other team's duo straight on or hunt down their roller user. and since there's 2 people on the front lines constantly spraying ink, and the other team is doing so as well, they always have somewhere to be. being a part of the duo is going to require a lot of skill, since you always have to be in the right place at the right time.
you also have a roller that's protected by a splattershot user that's vaguely close to them, so you have INSANE ink coverage on the flanks. this is probably the player that the duos are going to be hunting the entire game, and what makes up the meta. map control will be monumental in this game. if you shut down the opposing duo and consistently assassinate their roller user, you're denying them so much territory, they can't advance, and they can't win.

so here's the basic formula:

• 2 splatter users on the front, 1 roller user in the back, and 1 splatter user in between with an adaptable role
• the duo up front sprays the front line with ink and searches for the opposing teams roller user
• once they reach that roller user, either the other teams duo will be covering ink up front and it's just the roller user and splatter user, making the fight a 1v2, or its the entire team, making the fight a 3v2
• if its a 3v2, you have to buy time to get your other splatter user to the firefight with you to make it a 3v3
  
• conversely, if you're in the 1v2 scenario, you have to buy time to get your duo in the firefight to make it a 3v2
• the team that can consistently win these firefights and take down the roller users will have a substantial upper hand, because they're denying so much territory and covering it with their own ink
• teams will wobble back and forth doing this to each other, and the one that has players doing their jobs the best is the winning team, since they have control of the map

you can get really creative with team composition in this game, but with the current information we have alloted, i think this is going to be the most simple and effective one. you can't go wrong with this much adaptability.

 

[WydrA]

I agree Wyrda, it appears to be much more "role based" For Turf War, I would say it needs to be broken down like this:

Saltspray Rig - This map has some required tactics, otherwise you'll look at the map at the end and you'll see either the North or South was completely ignored.

• Charger - This guys needs to dominate the northern point. There is an excellent tower of boxes that gives the basic charger perfect range to cover the entire North platform. You can hold south box all day long but if they have 80% of north, that's like 12-15 percent total, and that's game. The problem with that is that it is harder for a charger user to get through center thoroughfare up to the north platform. That' what the next character is for.
• Roller 1 - This character is for covering and contesting most of the central thoroughfare and contesting the general central area of the map,
• Roller 2 - I'd say that two rollers is most effective on this map, mostly because the southern half of the map has causeways that are literally the perfect size for a roller to be able to cover about half of the map in less than 20 seconds. The team is probably set with this set up. This player will cover south and the corridors by it.
• Splatter - I think this is the havoc character for this level, helping cover North and South, given they are the more important and more defensible parts of the level.

Walleye Warehouse - This one is much more of a free-for-all, but a optimal team comp is preferred. Charger just isn't great for this map because the only real safe spot to snipe can't reach the middle of the map, and the box in front of that barely reaches the median. At best its a defensive setup, but it can be ganked by someone going up the right flank.

• Roller 1 - The thing I see often is that people forget to take their left flank up top, because that's probably the least likely to be recovered, plus its like 2% of the map. I can't tell you how often I saw that corridor completely bare at the end of the match.
• Roller 2 or Artist (Brusher) - Depending how fast the paintbrush is (I'm assuming very quick), they will be best at running up the left side corridor of the opponent and causing havoc in the base. If that proves t not be optimal, then another paintbrush doing the same thing.
• Splatter 1 & 2 - Playing the game like normal in the center and the right and left alcove.

This is what I've picked up from the Beta and in no way reflects item and loadout choices. Thoughts?

In my experience being a splatter on saltspray is hecka useful. You can splatterhop/dash to the north, get up on the crates, and Inkler (spin in circles spraying ink :P) and get huge turf incredibly quickly. You're also practically unreachable by rollers, and have the high ground advantage to anyone coming your way. Both times I play saltspray I used this tactic and got first on my team resulting in a win. Additionally, if you can spray all of the crates incredibly quickly and have super mobility. I don't I died in north once when using this technique. The charger can counter it if he get a good snipe, but that would also be hard since splatter can see him coming.

I definitely agree with rollers in the south. Especially since the crate there is small enough for them to be able to hit people standing on top.
I like your setup for walleye. I really don't see how a charger can be all that useful. Even when they get a longer distance weapon they won't actually be able to snipe too many people. There are too many hiding places.

 

[LittlestMinish]

In my experience being a splatter on saltspray is hecka useful. You can splatterhop/dash to the north, get up on the crates, and Inkler (spin in circles spraying ink :p) and get huge turf incredibly quickly. You're also practically unreachable by rollers, and have the high ground advantage to anyone coming your way. Both times I play saltspray I used this tactic and got first on my team resulting in a win. Additionally, if you can spray all of the crates incredibly quickly and have super mobility. I don't I died in north once when using this technique. The charger can counter it if he get a good snipe, but that would also be hard since splatter can see him coming.

I definitely agree with rollers in the south. Especially since the crate there is small enough for them to be able to hit people standing on top.
I like your setup for walleye. I really don't see how a charger can be all that useful. Even when they get a longer distance weapon they won't actually be able to snipe too many people. There are too many hiding places.

I would agree about the splatterer, A long range splatter or a medium range charger (anything that hit the slope that goes to the North and pick them off). I'd prefer the charger, if you can cover your advance to the North.

 

[WydrA]

I would agree about the splatterer, A long range splatter or a medium range charger (anything that hit the slope that goes to the North and pick them off). I'd prefer the charger, if you can cover your advance to the North.

idk, I just really feel like charger has no chance of making use of north the way splatter does. to a splatter north is perfect imo. t gives you unmatched mobility, hiding and ability to spread a heck of a lot of ink.
Charger could use the high ground well, but the inability to quickly spread ink bites them in the butt. They cant cover almost al of north within a couple seconds like splatter can, and they can't cover the boxes either, which means they're not nearly as slippery. They would need someone with them to gain that type of mobility, in which case it's kind of pointless. Why send two men to do a one man job?

 

[FunkyLobster]

chargers are for sure map dependant

they already have trouble being effective, but on maps without many open sightlines, it's completely unviable

i think if a competitive team REALLY wants to use it and sees something in it that i don't, they're going to have to use it on very specific maps like warehouse

 

[WydrA]

chargers are for sure map dependant

they already have trouble being effective, but on maps without many open sightlines, it's completely unviable

i think if a competitive team REALLY wants to use it and sees something in it that i don't, they're going to have to use it on very specific maps like warehouse

I think even warehouse is bad for it. the only straight sight line is right down the middle, and then there's no high ground except the very middle of the map (might as well paint yourself a target on your forehead) and near base, which is mostly out of range.

 

[FunkyLobster]

I think even warehouse is bad for it. the only straight sight line is right down the middle, and then there's no high ground except the very middle of the map (might as well paint yourself a target on your forehead) and near base, which is mostly out of range.

i definitely agree. the charger is only going to be viable for very specific compositions on very specific maps.

 

[LittlestMinish]

idk, I just really feel like charger has no chance of making use of north the way splatter does. to a splatter north is perfect imo. t gives you unmatched mobility, hiding and ability to spread a heck of a lot of ink.
Charger could use the high ground well, but the inability to quickly spread ink bites them in the butt. They cant cover almost al of north within a couple seconds like splatter can, and they can't cover the boxes either, which means they're not nearly as slippery. They would need someone with them to gain that type of mobility, in which case it's kind of pointless. Why send two men to do a one man job?

I can see that being a beneficial thing. That's why I said the slow fire-rate long range splatter gun is the best bet. Range and fire rate to get what needs done, done in the north. That might mean the long range charger could sit up top at the south, and given they are at a diagonal spot on South, they can capture a lot of area with it, as well as picking off the opposing people up top, as well as rollers down bottom.