Convince Me v52 isn't Overpowered

ThestralZ

Inkling Cadet
Joined
Jan 30, 2024
Messages
263
Location
Ohio, USA
Switch Friend Code
SW-1797-1352-6215
  1. It takes 0.3 seconds for a .52 Gal to do 104 damage to you. For reference, Splattershot has the same time to kill despite needing three shots to kill, and Range Blaster's startup frames are 0.2 seconds before you can shoot the gun.
  2. Splash Wall is just a "get out of bad positioning free" card. Negating a Zooka shot, multiple Pencil shots, Blaster shots, any bomb; it all combines to just be super annoying, especially because even though showering has been removed, it's still effortless to just change which side of the wall you're behind at a moment's notice to hide from bombs or other players.
  3. The downside of wall is that is has a large ink tank cost, but that cost is instantly negated by using Killer Wail. Wail is far from the most overpowered thing in this game, but it's still annoying to deal with especially because its global range.
This weapon just makes me mad. KGal was broken in S2, yet they still gave Gal wall immediately in S3. There wasn't even a launch nerf to the weapon. In fact, the first change S3 made to the weapon was a BUFF. The only nerf it's gotten was a reversal of that same BUFF. Gal is in the same territory as E-Liter and Ttek, where it's never been the meta-defining weapon like Splash, vShot or Pencil, but it's always been good and still hasn't been nerfed. I'll even go as far to call it shooter privilege. When Tri-Slosher had Burst Bomb in S2 and it was really good, Nintendo "learned" and hasn't put Burst Bomb on any sloshers in S3. When KGal was good, they imediatly put wall on Gal again and gave Gloogas the KGal kit. This game is so frustrating sometimes.
 

chaotik0

Inkling Cadet
Joined
Jan 30, 2024
Messages
227
i wouldn't say it's overpowered, it's just a little over tuned. also, since these maps are the way they are (terrible) the splash wall makes 52 even better. I haven't really ever had problems with any weapons in this game or thinking of them as "broken" or "overpowered" and i always think that's weird because it seems everybody has at least 1 weapon they hate. anyway, i can't relate to having hard times against .52s but i also play this game way too much so it could just be experience.

this is how i approach dealing with them:
52 gal is very good at bullying people out of their space very quickly, i play some slower weapons, so instead of trying to contest their range, speed and survivability with their wall, i let them over-extend and punish them immediately as they do. this can be done by waiting until they get to an area where at least two of you are at, meaning both of you can take them down, or hiding while they start charging through your color or teammates, in fact if you can go unnoticed before you start fighting them, they wouldn't have had their wall set up and won't be able to set it up quick enough while they fight you. be careful though, because if they just splatted a teammate, they have paint to work with around them.
Again, 52 with the wall has a good amount of survivability, so trying to contest the space it's holding by going in and playing normally isn't going to work. I like just ignoring it and deleting the rest of its team, which makes it impossible for the lone 52 to contest objective, allowing your team to push up, and while the 52 gal is good, it is not 1 v 4 good, and your team will end up winning. if the 52 is contesting an important area like a chokepoint, it will get shredded by your team immediately if their teammates aren't there to back them up.
if the 52 is targeting you for a fight though, these last two options don't exactly work. so if this happens here is what you do:

pray. hope that helps!

nah im just kidding, but against a good 52 gal that gets the jump on you, there won't be a lot you can do unless you are a very fast weapon (shooter or pre-charged splatling). if you do see them trying to approach you, there are ways to make it harder for them to contest you like running away, using your range or sub weapons, and painting or pre-firing before they get to you.

if none of that helps you at all, my bad. i know im supposed to be convincing you that 52 is not overpowered, but i care more about making this game less frustrating to play for people if i am able to do that. i also do think it is a bit too strong, like if it got bubble with its wall, that thing would be a nightmare. but, i would honestly see it more as a zooka counter than anything. i have never had a problem with 52 so if my advice is terrible, its probably because i was just taking the things that it is good at and thinking of ways i like to counter those things. in the middle of a match, my ability to comprehend is at 0% (it’s already pretty low), i just see action and make a reaction accordingly based on what i already know.
 

ThestralZ

Inkling Cadet
Joined
Jan 30, 2024
Messages
263
Location
Ohio, USA
Switch Friend Code
SW-1797-1352-6215
i wouldn't say it's overpowered, it's just a little over tuned. also, since these maps are the way they are (terrible) the splash wall makes 52 even better. I haven't really ever had problems with any weapons in this game or thinking of them as "broken" or "overpowered" and i always think that's weird because it seems everybody has at least 1 weapon they hate. anyway, i can't relate to having hard times against .52s but i also play this game way too much so it could just be experience.

this is how i approach dealing with them:
52 gal is very good at bullying people out of their space very quickly, i play some slower weapons, so instead of trying to contest their range, speed and survivability with their wall, i let them over-extend and punish them immediately as they do. this can be done by waiting until they get to an area where at least two of you are at, meaning both of you can take them down, or hiding while they start charging through your color or teammates, in fact if you can go unnoticed before you start fighting them, they wouldn't have had their wall set up and won't be able to set it up quick enough while they fight you. be careful though, because if they just splatted a teammate, they have paint to work with around them.
Again, 52 with the wall has a good amount of survivability, so trying to contest the space it's holding by going in and playing normally isn't going to work. I like just ignoring it and deleting the rest of its team, which makes it impossible for the lone 52 to contest objective, allowing your team to push up, and while the 52 gal is good, it is not 1 v 4 good, and your team will end up winning. if the 52 is contesting an important area like a chokepoint, it will get shredded by your team immediately if their teammates aren't there to back them up.
if the 52 is targeting you for a fight though, these last two options don't exactly work. so if this happens here is what you do:

pray. hope that helps!

nah im just kidding, but against a good 52 gal that gets the jump on you, there won't be a lot you can do unless you are a very fast weapon (shooter or pre-charged splatling). if you do see them trying to approach you, there are ways to make it harder for them to contest you like running away, using your range or sub weapons, and painting or pre-firing before they get to you.

if none of that helps you at all, my bad. i know im supposed to be convincing you that 52 is not overpowered, but i care more about making this game less frustrating to play for people if i am able to do that. i also do think it is a bit too strong, like if it got bubble with its wall, that thing would be a nightmare. but, i would honestly see it more as a zooka counter than anything. i have never had a problem with 52 so if my advice is terrible, its probably because i was just taking the things that it is good at and thinking of ways i like to counter those things. in the middle of a match, my ability to comprehend is at 0% (it’s already pretty low), i just see action and make a reaction accordingly based on what i already know.
No, I appreciate the advice, I'll try doing this. I also probably did exaggerate its power, but then again, I can have opinions. But thank you.
 

Lisku

Inkling Commander
Joined
Jan 30, 2024
Messages
453
Pronouns
He/him
EXACTLY!!! 52 takes less skill than try slosher
 

chaotik0

Inkling Cadet
Joined
Jan 30, 2024
Messages
227
No, I appreciate the advice, I'll try doing this. I also probably did exaggerate its power, but then again, I can have opinions. But thank you.
i can't hold it against you that you have feelings, it wouldn't be fair. it is probably really easy to get mad at this game and get frustrated, especially when the game moves so fast and has so much stuff going on it can be hard to learn what you need to do to improve. plus, it's not like your opinions are entirely just wrong, 52 is a pretty strong weapon that can be difficult to fight.

i will also say that it is really hard to just "try doing" something and learning something in this game, again, because of the pace and the stuff going on can be all over the place. focusing on winning makes you take everything going on in the game into account, and that is a lot to handle especially if you are trying to learn and try things out. i would say to focus on those things more than just focusing on winning.

anyway i may have talked too much this thread so i think this is where i stop
 

OnePotWonder

Inkling Fleet Admiral
Joined
Jan 31, 2024
Messages
752
Location
Marooner’s Bay
Pronouns
He/Him
Switch Friend Code
SW-2068-8904-6306
1712639613459.png


v52 is a disgrace to the Killer Wail 5.1 lineup. It is by far the worst main-special combo in the game, nay, the series. Without a doubt.
(Yes, I am saying that this is worse than 220p Inkzooka on Rapid Pro in S1. At least that special synergized when the weapon got it.)
.52 Gal Deco in Splatoon 1 had Inkstrike.
.52 would be a better Strikes weapon than Ttek and NeoSplash combined because its wall would let it live using its special up close.
.52 Gal in Splatoon 2 had Baller.
.52 is the perfect shooter to get Reefslider because of how aggressive it is, and how it's able to combo off of the explosion damage.
Forget the weapon being overpowered, I just really despise the kit choice. And I'm probably the #1 Killer Wail 5.1 lover on this forum.

Anyway, on an unrelated note, why don't people also complain about Splattershot when it splats just as fast with better consistency?
Can someone please explain to me why .52 is overpowered but Shot isn't?
 
Last edited:

Masked_Katz

Gnarly Eddy's Boyfriend
Joined
Jan 30, 2024
Messages
121
Location
Tennessee
Switch Friend Code
SW-3907-3792-4200
I'm not saying the .52 and .96 gals aren't good, but... to me it seems like the rest of their kits were purposely handicapped to compensate for the power of the main weapon.
They all lack subs that deal much damage (the opposite of the splattershots) and their specials don't really synergize the best either, like OnePotWonder mentioned.
I have a lot of fun playing the weapon myself, but I could never get hooked on it unlike the other shooters due to its overall kit, and I'm sure that's why it's not as popular in competitive play, especially compared to what was seen in the last game.
 
Last edited:

Dessgeega

Egyptian Goo God
Joined
Feb 23, 2016
Messages
2,535
Switch Friend Code
SW-3756-0533-5215
The 52 has to play around it's wall as much as you do when you're facing it, since bombs can be unexpectedly deadly for the 52 when thrown directly at the wall. It's paint also isn't the greatest for it's range category. Finally, randomness can kill you with stray shots, it may have a fast kill time but that kill time can go way up if any shots miss. The weapon is strong but not infallible.

Furthermore, let's take a look at the meta these days. According to competitive friends of mine, that mostly consists of a snipewriter, splattershot, and two midline weapons. Tacticooler and Trizooka specials. No mention of the 52. If it were as overpowered as you think, it would be as inescapable as these weapons and specials.

Complaining doesn't win matches. This game has issues, plenty of them really, but when it comes to the weapons nothing is so inherently strong that it can't be overcome with good tactics and skilled play. You'll get better results trying to learn from your losses instead of deeming anything "broken" or "overpowered".
 

ThestralZ

Inkling Cadet
Joined
Jan 30, 2024
Messages
263
Location
Ohio, USA
Switch Friend Code
SW-1797-1352-6215
The 52 has to play around it's wall as much as you do when you're facing it, since bombs can be unexpectedly deadly for the 52 when thrown directly at the wall. It's paint also isn't the greatest for it's range category. Finally, randomness can kill you with stray shots, it may have a fast kill time but that kill time can go way up if any shots miss. The weapon is strong but not infallible.

Furthermore, let's take a look at the meta these days. According to competitive friends of mine, that mostly consists of a snipewriter, splattershot, and two midline weapons. Tacticooler and Trizooka specials. No mention of the 52. If it were as overpowered as you think, it would be as inescapable as these weapons and specials.

Complaining doesn't win matches. This game has issues, plenty of them really, but when it comes to the weapons nothing is so inherently strong that it can't be overcome with good tactics and skilled play. You'll get better results trying to learn from your losses instead of deeming anything "broken" or "overpowered".
My brother in squid, Gal had a 10% comp use in the SendouQ Season 2 Tournament. That's more than Ttek and vRoller. Just because a weapon isn't literally the best weapon in the game doesn't mean it isn't good. The reason I said overpowered is because wall shuts down a lot of options that could normally counter .52, which isn't great. Based on this thread it seems the general way to counter it is to coordinate with your team to kite it or shoot both sides of the wall. There is counter play. I never said there wasn't any, I was just explaining why I thought Gal's strengths were oppressive in my opinion.
 

Masked_Katz

Gnarly Eddy's Boyfriend
Joined
Jan 30, 2024
Messages
121
Location
Tennessee
Switch Friend Code
SW-3907-3792-4200
Your response really confuses me, it seems less like you find the weapon to be overpowered and moreso just annoying to play against, especially after rereading the initial points you made mentioning that
 

ThestralZ

Inkling Cadet
Joined
Jan 30, 2024
Messages
263
Location
Ohio, USA
Switch Friend Code
SW-1797-1352-6215
Your response really confuses me, it seems less like you find the weapon to be overpowered and moreso just annoying to play against, especially after rereading the initial points you made mentioning that
It is annoying but I think it's overpowered because it is really hard for one single weapon to kill the Gal. It requires teamwork, which while that is a way to counter it, is really hard to do in Solo Q where I mostly play, especially if there is a number disadvantage.
 

Dessgeega

Egyptian Goo God
Joined
Feb 23, 2016
Messages
2,535
Switch Friend Code
SW-3756-0533-5215
My brother in squid, Gal had a 10% comp use in the SendouQ Season 2 Tournament. That's more than Ttek and vRoller. Just because a weapon isn't literally the best weapon in the game doesn't mean it isn't good. The reason I said overpowered is because wall shuts down a lot of options that could normally counter .52, which isn't great. Based on this thread it seems the general way to counter it is to coordinate with your team to kite it or shoot both sides of the wall. There is counter play. I never said there wasn't any, I was just explaining why I thought Gal's strengths were oppressive in my opinion.
https://squidboards.com/threads/wea...ajor-chart-by-https-twitter-com-oliytc.43902/
Is this what you're referring to? The usage chart where there's 8 weapons that had higher comp usage? I don't see how that helps your case when only a handful of matches separate the comp usage of the two weapons you mention. Had people played even slightly differently those weapons could have been higher on the list. And no comments about the snipewriter or regular splattershot that were in over a hundred matches?

The weapon can't simultaneously be oppressive and overpowered while also having clear counters and statistics such as this. If you don't like the weapon and don't like fighting it, that's fine. Everyone has counters to their preferred playstyle. But as I said, complaining doesn't win matches.
 

ThestralZ

Inkling Cadet
Joined
Jan 30, 2024
Messages
263
Location
Ohio, USA
Switch Friend Code
SW-1797-1352-6215
https://squidboards.com/threads/wea...ajor-chart-by-https-twitter-com-oliytc.43902/
Is this what you're referring to? The usage chart where there's 8 weapons that had higher comp usage? I don't see how that helps your case when only a handful of matches separate the comp usage of the two weapons you mention. Had people played even slightly differently those weapons could have been higher on the list. And no comments about the snipewriter or regular splattershot that were in over a hundred matches?

The weapon can't simultaneously be oppressive and overpowered while also having clear counters and statistics such as this. If you don't like the weapon and don't like fighting it, that's fine. Everyone has counters to their preferred playstyle. But as I said, complaining doesn't win matches.
Twice now you've ignored my comment of "it doesn't need to be the best weapon to be really good." People have been talking about Snipewriter and Splattershot a lot in other threads, this isn't a place to complain about those weapons. It's not even a place to complain about Gal, there is a difference between complaining and discussing. The goal of this thread was to 1. Show me that people either agreed with my perspective or disagreed and showed why, and 2. Show me ways to counter Gal so I stop losing fights against them.
 

Shortcake

Inkster Jr.
Joined
Jan 30, 2024
Messages
33
Location
Britain
Switch Friend Code
SW-1636-2040-6048
2. Show me ways to counter Gal so I stop losing fights against them.
main strat is to wall it out of where it wants to be because it has 0 ways of safely contesting space w/o a wall up (wail is annoying but it can't force you to stop controlling an area) which requires it to have physical access to somewhere next to where it wants to contest.
also if 52 jumps ever / fires for a while it's shot rng is going to be extremely inconsistent for ~1-2 seconds so if you can fight it it won't be able to effectively shoot back
 

Shortcake

Inkster Jr.
Joined
Jan 30, 2024
Messages
33
Location
Britain
Switch Friend Code
SW-1636-2040-6048
Anyway, on an unrelated note, why don't people also complain about Splattershot when it splats just as fast with better consistency?
-more range
-12 frame kill time vs 15 frame kill time
-first few shots have perfect accuracy anyway*
-splash wall is annoying
-weaknesses that are hard to abuse and aren't very clear in the first place vs strengths that are very obvious

*it can technically deviate by up to 0.3 degrees oh the humanity
 

Babab

Full Squid
Joined
Feb 5, 2024
Messages
39
Pronouns
He/Him
Switch Friend Code
SW-7735-7052-6321
I’m just annoyed about the ‘shot spread/rng ‘
I can’t tell you how many times I’ve been two-shotted by a mid-air 52. I know the rng is best on the first few shots you fire, but the rng just seems kinda broken.
 

RubberCF

Semi-Pro Squid
Joined
Jan 31, 2024
Messages
80
Pronouns
He/Him
Switch Friend Code
SW-2041-7487-3622
Rlly, 52 kills faster than shot if you meassure ttk from the first bullet hitting to the last. Then 52 kills in 10 frames, and shot in 13
 

RubberCF

Semi-Pro Squid
Joined
Jan 31, 2024
Messages
80
Pronouns
He/Him
Switch Friend Code
SW-2041-7487-3622
-more range
-12 frame kill time vs 15 frame kill time
-first few shots have perfect accuracy anyway*
-splash wall is annoying
-weaknesses that are hard to abuse and aren't very clear in the first place vs strengths that are very obvious

*it can technically deviate by up to 0.3 degrees oh the humanity
Where are you getting the additional 2 frames off ttk for each
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top Bottom