Final Smash Presentation Discussion

[Meechy2000]

Come on, now. You think Sakurai could've started development at the beginning of the month (to see if the award was won or not) and have footage in time two weeks later?

Come on!He could have done a presentation later in the year or not have made it the final presentation.

 

[DarkGold777]

This still doesn't mean it's gonna stick around. Hell, it's already been confirmed that there isn't gonna be paid DLC for Splatoon. They're already dropping support for the game and it's already looking bad. Super Mario Maker's where Nintendo's gonna be dropping loads of DLC from now on. Idiots......

You are REALLY pessimistic about this.

First off, what do you mean "already dropping support for the game"? We got a half-year's worth of additional content to the point that Splatoon is packed with content, and even if support drops now, Splatoon still has so much that it'd be a struggle for it to lose popularity, much like a typical Smash game. I have no idea why you think it's "looking bad". Second, what hints that Nintendo is going to focus most their efforts on SMM DLC? I doubt they're going to spend so much time on it to the point that their future games deteriorate, especially since most of their updates so far is checkpoints and sprite costumes of only a tiny amount of frames, among bug fixes. That's not too much.

Nintendo isn't derping up. Keep away from the panic button, y'all.

 

[ShinyGirafarig]

How many Nintendo games even get a book devoted to showing off its concept art? I imported the Splatoon Ikasu Artbook and it has over 300 pages. This game is being shown love.

 

[Meechy2000]

Or they could have said that they are working on inklings and stages and planning on making stages and content in 2016 just like they did with Corrin and Bayonetta.That don't even know when Bayonetta is coming out.They said they PLAN on releasing her in February.

Or they could have said that they are working on inklings and stages and planning on making stages and content in 2016 just like they did with Corrin and Bayonetta.That don't even know when Bayonetta is coming out.They said they PLAN on releasing her in February.

 

[Of Moose & Men]

Except Bayonetta was the character that was voted into the game. What's the point in having the ballot if they're just going to sweep the entire thing under the rug and use a character they personally prefer?

Corrin was added to pull in for the new FE game, Bayonetta was voted in. Deal with it.

 

[Meechy2000]

What about Ryu? I'm not saying they should have picked inklings over Bayonetta.I'm actually shocked thats she is in it.But i'm not mad i'm dissapointed.Any characters could have been in smash ,i don't even care if it was Shrek,I'm saying they should have put inklings in no matter what because they are a famouse icon like mario,pokimon ect.Bayonetta,Corrin,Cloud could have still been in but they should have even added inklings.I'm not saying replace Bayonetta with Inklings.I'm saying add them in.

Except Bayonetta was the character that was voted into the game. What's the point in having the ballot if they're just going to sweep the entire thing under the rug and use a character they personally prefer?

Corring was added to pull in for the new FE game, Bayonetta was voted in. Deal with it.

 

[PrinceOfKoopas]

Or they could have said that they are working on inklings and stages and planning on making stages and content in 2016 just like they did with Corrin and Bayonetta.That don't even know when Bayonetta is coming out.They said they PLAN on releasing her in February.

Or they could have said that they are working on inklings and stages and planning on making stages and content in 2016 just like they did with Corrin and Bayonetta.That don't even know when Bayonetta is coming out.They said they PLAN on releasing her in February.

But they had a ton of in-game footage of Bayonetta. That takes a ton of time to make.

Obviously Sakurai's team was doing this before the Ballot ended.

 

[Of Moose & Men]

What about Ryu? I'm not saying they should have picked inklings over Bayonetta.I'm actually shocked thats she is in it.But i'm not mad i'm dissapointed.Any characters could have been in smash ,i don't even care if it was Shrek,I'm saying they should have put inklings in no matter what because they are a famouse icon like mario,pokimon ect.Bayonetta,Corrin,Cloud could have still been in but they should have even added inklings.I'm not saying replace Bayonetta with Inklings.I'm saying add them in.

I mean, going by that logic, Isaac, Shantae, Shovel Knight, and Excite Bike should have been put in Smash Bros. Since they aren't adding every "Famous Icon" in Smash, they have to come to an agreement on who does get added.

Again, what would be the point of the Ballot if they're just going to add all these characters because "they're classic Icons".

 

[Meechy2000]

I mean, going by that logic, Isaac, Shantae, Shovel Knight, and Excite Bike should have been put in Smash Bros. Since they aren't adding every "Famous Icon" in Smash, they have to come to an agreement on who does get added.

Again, what would be the point of the Ballot if they're just going to add all these characters because "they're classic Icons".

I did not say classic icons.I said famous icons.

But they had a ton of in-game footage of Bayonetta. That takes a ton of time to make.

Obviously Sakurai's team was doing this before the Ballot ended.

SO clearly it was a false asomption if they did it before the ballot ended.

I mean, going by that logic, Isaac, Shantae, Shovel Knight, and Excite Bike should have been put in Smash Bros. Since they aren't adding every "Famous Icon" in Smash, they have to come to an agreement on who does get added.

Again, what would be the point of the Ballot if they're just going to add all these characters because "they're classic Icons".

Shovel knight and whovever that other character is isnt a famouse icon.Every famous nintendo Icon is in smash if you really look at it.Mario,pokimon,kirby,donky kong ect.

What...do you mean?

So your saying they created a character they assumed that was gonna win before the votes was even completely in?

 

[Of Moose & Men]

I did not say classic icons.I said famous icons.

Those aren't famous icons? That is damn near a synonym. You avoided the entire point of my statement though, not bad.

 

[PrinceOfKoopas]

SO clearly it was a false asomption if they did it before the ballot ended.

What...do you mean?

 

[Of Moose & Men]

Shovel knight and whovever that other character is isnt a famouse icon.Every famous nintendo Icon is in smash if you really look at it.Mario,pokimon,kirby,donky kong ect.

Lol. . . Okay, well, if you're talking by your standards then I guess. But they are most CERTAINLY famous icons.

 

[PrinceOfKoopas]

So your saying they created a character they assumed that was gonna win before the votes was even completely in?

Yes. Which hurts my feelings as someone who waited until the end of August to vote.

But you can get to a point where you can call the results before every vote is counted. Happens in elections and polls alike.

 

[Meechy2000]

its late,im ending this ignorant conversation people have a life and actual jobs to do in the morning so i dont have time for this irrelevant conversation about some characters in a game so in conclusion Bsyonetta is in smash,Corrin is in smash Inklings are not Boohoo and goodnight.

 

[Of Moose & Men]

Lol, love how you're trying to make us seem like the ignorant cry babies.

 

[Zombie Aladdin]

I think SMM and Splat have different development teams, so I don't see It as SMM taking anything away from Splatoon. It's more likely that the devs want to finish out with Splatoon so that they can get started on a sequel while they have the green light from Ninty's execs. Game development averages around 18 months (so I've read). If they want to get a title out on the NX and still have a year or two of console life left, they'd certainly need to get started soon if Ninty is serious about a Spring 2016 debut for their new toy. Splatoon really doesn't need DLC, so I don't think end of support is a big problem. If it means they can get to work on a follow-up, I think little-to-no DLC is a fair trade considering this game is really fine as is.

Some games under Nintendo take longer than that though. Every Super Smash Bros. game after the first one has had a longer development cycle, as are main-series Legend of Zelda games and Pokémon games. (Whenever a Pokémon generation is introduced, for instance, the designers at Game Freak immediately begin designing the next generation. This means that the time between Pokémon generations is really the amount of time it takes to make a Pokémon game.)

Some indie games also take longer than 18 months, but that's for different reasons entirely.

You seem to be under the impression that Splatoon will just flat-out die when they stop releasing new content for it. Just... no... My point in my previous post was that the game is simply too popular to just die out when they stop feeding us new stuff every week. Smash DLC is ending in February, but is that game going to die? Of course not! Splatoon is going to end off with more than triple the maps and over double the weapons it started with, not to mention Splatfests still being a thing, and probably Octolings (I'm sorry but a lack of plans for paid DLC =/= a lack of plans for playable Octolings). If stopping new content for the game after all that is an idiotic move, then I guess Nintendo is the smartest group of idiots out there.

Yeah... I just said that... >.>

Another example is Mario Kart. Mario Kart DS and Mario Kart Wii continued to sell and have a lot of people playing online all the way until Nintendo Wi-Fi Connection was discontinued. Mario Kart 7 and Mario Kart 8 are both strong sellers nowadays, with them next to each other, usually swapping spots at the bottom of top-10 selling games week by week (in Japan, at least; reliable numbers are a lot harder to find worldwide). And of these, only Mario Kart 8 has had DLC (besides patches).

Pokémon games and Super Mario games continue to sell very well long after their releases too (the former causing the "Pokémon Premium" for used copies where they continue to sell for almost as much as retail even after the next generation comes out), as are Smash Bros. games, Wii Series games, and Animal Crossing games. Minor IPs play out this way too: Yoshi's Woolly World is currently exhibiting sustained post-release sales, for instance. This type of sales pattern is known as the "long tail" or "evergreen," and Nintendo is VERY good at it. The only major IPs Nintendo has that have a quick-burn sales pattern are Kirby, F-Zero, Pikmin, and sometimes Zelda. And Nintendo rarely ever needs DLC to sustain them, and it's arguable any of them never needed DLC in the first place. It does help that Nintendo continues to promote its games long after release though.

Long tail sales are things people at EA and Activision can only dream of, as games like the Call of Duty series and Assassin's Creed series rely on yearly installments because their appeal dies out by that time. (Ubisoft can pull off lasting appeal though, but it requires artistic geniuses like Michel Ancel to do it.)

On a related note, Sonic the Hedgehog games predominantly get long tail sales too: Sonic Colors, for instance, passed the 1 million sales mark a year after its release. Three years later, it passed the 2 million sales mark.

Of course Inkling would've been a great addition (he was my 2nd most wanted character actually), but I can see how they would've had trouble with implementing some kind of unique ink mechanics that could affect stages and characters, especially when you consider 8-player Smash with 8 Inklings. At least when we eventually get a Smash 5 I think Inkling's inclusion will be planned from the beginning so they'll have more time and manpower to bring out the full potential of the character.

Yeah, I see the Inklings as being the next Villager: Even if there was the necessary time to put them in (and I don't think they did), there would've been many issues with how an Inkling can function in a Smash Bros. context while staying true to his or her own game. Particularly for Super Smash Bros. for Wii U and 3DS, great pains have been taken to try to keep each newcomer faithful to his or her roots. Someone like Ryu could fit right in. The Inklings, however, would've clashed completely.

But they had a ton of in-game footage of Bayonetta. That takes a ton of time to make.

Obviously Sakurai's team was doing this before the Ballot ended.

I can confirm that this is at least what some game developers do: Post-release DLC for Sonic & All-Stars Racing Transformed was to be decided by a vote, and Steve Lycett, the producer and director of the game, told people at the SEGA Forums that he predicted and observed the early leaders, starting work on them long before the polls ended (with the exception of Hatsune Miku, whom no one on the team expected would take 2nd place). When he pitched them to the people at SEGA, they were already well in progress. Several months later, the poll's winner, Ryo Hazuki from Shenmue, was added as DLC. (The game itself dropped in popularity on every platform except Steam by then though, so Ryo was Steam-only.)

As for the other characters, I think they were dropped in favor of other, unrelated characters that SEGA insisted be put in, like the Football Manager and Total War's Shogun. And Yogscast Simon. (For the record, Bayonetta took 5th place. Here's the chart, if anyone's interested. The line for 1,000 votes is in yellow because that's the minimum needed for Lycett to pitch those characters.)

 

[Cadet Strongarm]

Wii U sales have skyrocketed in the last 2 years, their games have been absolutely amazing, and some have won awards at the VGAs.
You are the biggest pessimist I have ever had the displeasure of forum-ing with, I thought it was just about your absolute blind dislike for the Inklings not making it, but it's just everything that you type is some form of sulking and is just outright depressing.

Aside From Pokken And Starfox Zero what does the wii-u have to offer in 2016? they have gotten a sales increase yes but most third party companies have abandoned nintendo and this generation seems to be opting more for great third party multi plat games instead of first party exclusives

it's why sony made deals for destiny call of duty and battlefront

 

[Of Moose & Men]

Aside From Pokken And Starfox Zero what does the wii-u have to offer in 2016? they have gotten a sales increase yes but most third party companies have abandoned nintendo and this generation seems to be opting more for great third party multi plat games instead of first party exclusives

it's why sony made deals for destiny call of duty and battlefront

The new LoZ game, TP HD, Dragon Quest X, and Shin Megami Tensei X Fire Emblem don't count? I mean, we're not going to have their ENTIRE 2016 line up, but they definitely have plenty of big name games coming in 2016. 2016 hasn't even began yet, how on earth could you possibly know the Wii U is "dead"?

 

[Cadet Strongarm]

The new LoZ game, TP HD, Dragon Quest X, and Shin Megami Tensei X Fire Emblem don't count? I mean, we're not going to have their ENTIRE 2016 line up, but they definitely have plenty of big name games coming in 2016. 2016 hasn't even began yet, how on earth could you possibly know the Wii U is "dead"?

because it's sales are lower than both it's competitors(Sony has already over 20 million PS4's worldwide and Wii-u Has not even sold close to that despite having a year head start compared to PS4 And XB1)and the average gamer doesn't seem to want nintendo games anymore they want first person military shooter games and cinematic action adventure stories

i like the wii-u and some of the unique games it brings such as mario maker and splatoon but i won't sit here and pretend that everything's alright and that it's sales aren't pathetic compared to microsoft and sony's output

 

[Of Moose & Men]

because it's sales are lower than both it's competitors(Sony has already over 20 million PS4's worldwide and Wii-u Has not even sold close to that despite having a year head start compared to PS4 And XB1)and the average gamer doesn't seem to want nintendo games anymore they want first person military shooter games and cinematic action adventure stories

You act like that's new. If you're new to this, allow me to give you some food for thought. Nintendo has never been one to try extremely hard for its hardcore gamer demographic. Nintendo has ALWAYS been about the casual gamer. I mean, the fact the Wii and Wii U happened are clear indications of such. They have never been one to try and appeal to the hardcore gamer demographic, and I HIGHLY doubt they ever will intend to. The problem with that is, now, that is what people want, hardcore, competitive games. With the new trend of wanting such things, it leaves Nintendo to sort of be pushed to the wayside when contemplating choosing between a Wii U and PS4 or XB1. If you're looking for a console built for Hardcore gaming, you're looking at the wrong system.

So in short, the recent rise in Hardcore gamers is the reason Wii U is often left behind, because it doesn't appeal to those people, thus, doesn't sell as much, etc. you get the point. Either way, comparing it to the titans that are PS4 and WB1 is a bit unfair since, as I just explained, they appeal to two entirely different demographics.

Regardless, that is in absolutely no way, an indication that the Wii U is dying.