Final Smash Presentation Discussion

[BlackZero]

and yet the wii-u wasn't the smashing hit that the wii was....go figure

i enjoy the wii-u whenever i get on it but to pretend that it isn't the laughing stock of the video game industry is a total farce

most kids aren't asking for a wii-u they either want an xbox one or a ps4 because that's what all their friends have and they wanna be the cool kid too

we're in the age of 8-10 year olds running around with iphones and tablets

when nintendo's target audience is associated more with call of duty than games suited to their age group what does that tell you?

Risk means failure; no one is disputing that. But failure teaches you more than success. Did the Wii U flop? Probably. But it's given Nintendo valuable information on the direction they need to take the NX.

If you enjoy the Wii U, why does it matter if it's a laughing stock? Seriously, who cares? I drive a Honda Civic. I hear from people who have muscle cars all the time "why didn't you get a Mustang or a Camero?" I tell them "If you want to pay for it, I'll drive anything you want me to." Who cares if people think the Wii U is stupid if you enjoy playing it? That's high school status symbol bullshit and nothing else.

It tells me that there are many people out there who are more worried about their public image than playing games they enjoy. I don't really care if Pokémon or Splatoon are "kids games." They keep me amused, which is why I got them. I don't really care what age group their intended for so long as I enjoy them.

You seem to be more worried about playing games that make you fit in with a certain group of people than enjoying yourself. That's a very unfortunate attitude that I hope you lose sooner than later. If you aren't comfortable being yourself, I almost guarantee you won't be comfortable being anyone else.

 

[Cadet Strongarm]

this isn't about fitting in it's about having a community of people you deem as friends to chat with and play games with on the system and The NX Seriously needs to get on the boat with the community system that Xbox And Playstation have

you seem to think if someone disagrees with the way nintendo does things or believes they aren't really the console of choice for kids anymore that they have self esteem issues and are plagued by peer pressure to get the console that the media tells them to get...

when that isn't the case if i cared about fitting in I'd have nothing but war games and madden not all this JRPG Crap and fighting games

i like the wii-u but i find myself using it less and less...hell Splatoon And Super Mario Maker were the two games that actually made me start paying attention to my wii-u again

and they were the only two wii-u games i got this year before then the last wii-u game i got was Smash Bros Last Year

the wii-u is a console that can keep you entertained for awhile but eventually you gotta switch it up and go somewhere else it works fine as a secondary console but as anyone's only console or prime console it falls apart

it just doesn't have enough of what everyone wants to consider it before anything else

i guess if you don't really have enough time to play video games(School/Work Perhaps?) it might work but for someone whose schedule is more flexible it just doesn't cut it

 

[AidanC97]

I just watched the presentation yesterday evening. I was not at all surprised by Bayonetta being in the game. I called it when the Ballot first arrived and sure enough She won. Now the presentation itself was great, with new Mii outfits and what not, new characters are introduced as well. It's a great farewell to the game IMO

 

[Zombie Aladdin]

As Steve Jobs most perfectly surmised, "the customer doesn't know what they want until they see it." The reason why Nintendo has stayed afloat all these years is because they are willing to take risks, and more of those risks have paid off than not. They could have very easily played it safe with each console only offering graphics/processing improvements, but they experimented with new ideas that ended up becoming industry standards. There really wasn't any need to develop a "fancy" hand-held console with "basic" home consoles. Well, there wasn't until after they went ahead and made one.

You were the one saying people need to adapt to the future or stay in the past with the rest of the dinosaurs. Now you're saying there's no need to innovate; just keep doing what's worked all along. Thing is, there was a time when what's worked all along didn't exist; someone had to start it. People who adapt to the future ARE the dinosaurs; people who MAKE the future are the ones who survive the next generation. Imagination rules the world, and Nintendo has shown they have plenty of it.

I'm not sure if you're living proof of Steve Jobs' sentiment, are arguing for the fun of it, or think that pessimism is edgy and cool; you've bounced between wanting innovation & growth and preferring the status quo all the while proselytizing Nintendo's and Splatoon's imminent demise due to both. I don't know which it is, but I'll say this: they know what they're doing. They have a tendency to play the proverbial long game where most companies and consumers focus on the short term. There's a reason why every journalist and armchair expert criticizes Nintendo's horrible decisions year after year, yet the company is still chugging right along. It's called long-term thinking: they're willing to take a few short-term blows on the chin in order to secure long-term successes.

Not just video games either. Every industry is like this. Very few businesses would be recognizable today than when their industries began. H.J. Heinz made thick and sour ketchup the standard with everyone else imitating him; prior to that, ketchup was runny, salty, and prohibitively expensive because it required 6 hours to cook and spoiled in 2 hours. Nestlé had the idea to add milk to chocolate and invented milk chocolate in that way; Hershey's was the only other company able to keep up with Nestlé because William Hershey figured out Nestlé's recipe. (Mars came later, and Ghirardelli pretty much stole Nestlé's secrets and took them to San Francisco.) Even non-businesses need to keep up: John F. Kennedy defeated Richard Nixon in the 1960 U.S. presidential election because he was more prepared to debate on television than Nixon (though, of course, Nixon later learned how to do it too).

And for a contrasting example, remember when Motorola was a household name in the 90's into the mid-00's? The reason why no one talks about them anymore is because they failed to keep up: Whereas other companies like Samsung and Nokia pushed ahead and released digital phones, Motorola executives were convinced digital would not take off and kept their phones analog, and they fell behind harshly because of it. And Nokia has since fallen behind due to the Blackberry smartphone's lack of a large touch screen and got itself bought by Microsoft and most of its staff laid off.

Not only that, Nintendo technically pioneered gyroscopic/Sixaxis controls with the Gameboy Tilt sensor. They were also the first to introduce shoulder-buttons, afaik. They also brought PC shooters to the console world with Goldeneye 64. I hate to make a "kids these days" statement, but I don't think most of the newer generations of gamers understand how many things that are par for the course today were pioneered by Nintendo. It's pretty funny to hear hardcore gamers dump on Nintendo while their games and consoles use a lot of concepts Ninty created. The only things Sony and Xbox can really offer are better graphics and processing speeds. Basically, they're using SEGA's old "Blast Processing" sales pitch because they really don't have any of their own innovations to brag about.

Arguably, the Sony and Microsoft systems did create at least one industry standard: Reliable online play. Then again, even that was not popularized by them, but by SEGA with the Dreamcast, with Chu Chu Rocket! and Phantasy Star Online pioneering the way, the former also being the first major console release to have DLC. But the PS3 and Xbox did make online gaming fluid and consistent.

It's a shame SEGA self-destructed with corporate mismanagement. The Dreamcast and Saturn were both very good systems. The only thing stopping them was the fact that no-one knew about them outside of Nihonland. If they had executed competent international marketing and distribution, there very well could still be a Nintendo-SEGA console war today.

I'd blame Bernie Stolar on that. The guy was mismanaging Sony's American video games branch for some time (but was held in line by his colleagues) and let go, where he then joined SEGA and proceeded to cancel projects and create vanity projects that drove SEGA into the ground. He's now working as a freelance grunt-levle programmer, where I feel he belongs.

adapting doesn't mean you have to make a complete gimmick related console with wacky controls it just means you just stay ahead of the competition and know what's best

Motion Controls were never going to win over gamers in the long run....everyone knows that

when everyone plays a video game i think they prefer the controller to be as basic as possible that doesn't mean it can't have any new features but they don't want it to come off as some obnoxious piece of hardware that's trying too hard to be cool and hip

why do you think the sony dualshock controller has so many fans? it's basic but still has made some upgrades over the years without completely scrapping it's entire design for something unknown and new

we've come to the point where innovation in a console is harder to come by....why risk it all on a new untested style when you can make slight improvements upon what's already been working for you?

PS2---->PS3
Xbox----->360
Gamecube----->Wii

those were big leaps and changes

but this

PS3----->PS4
360---->Xbone
Wii---->Wii-u

it's just a slightly upgraded version of the past generation there's nothing as big or as interesting to comment on like last time

Did you miss BlackZero's entire point? Nintendo's whole schtick is innovation. They created a ton of stuff that became industry standards today. Theres a reason why Nintendo is by far the oldest company in video games (having been founded in 1895). Here's a run-down on what's been covered:

NES: Made video games palatable to North Americans after the Great Video Game Crash of 1982. Made video games appealing to families. Invented multiplayer.
Super Mario Bros.: Popularized platformers. Introduced scrolling. Introduced background music while playing. Introduced a goal at the end.
The Legend of Zelda: Invented the battery-based game save.
Duck Hunt: Brought shooters to home consoles.
Final Fantasy: Brought JRPGs to the west. Also inspired digital RPGs in general.
Super Mario Bros. 3: Invented video game maps for fast travel. First very long 2-D platformer.
Famicom Wars: Popularized strategy RPGs.

Game Boy: Made handheld gaming popular.
Tetris: First falling-blocks puzzle game. Will forever be the most popular falling-blocks puzzle game.
Pokémon: Popularized monster-collecting games. Still the only major multiplayer-oriented turn-based RPG on the market.
Game Boy Camera: Introduced cameras on handheld devices. Built-in mini-games created ideas of avatars based on the players themselves.

SNES: Increased technology was used to do things not previously possible in games, as listed below.
Donkey Kong Country: Popularized pre-rendered sprites and backgrounds.
EarthBound: While not obvious to a player, its unique code set the way for more innovative and efficient game programming in the future.
The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past: First 3-D polygons in a video game (the Triforce).
Star Fox: Mode 7 scrolling was made for this game, allowing 3-D-looking gameplay. Would later be used further in F-Zero and Super Mario Kart.
Super Mario Kart: Popularized the kart racer, such as wacky course designs and use of items.
Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars: Popularized the humorous RPG.

Game Boy Color:
Super Mario Bros. Deluxe: Popularized the idea of handheld re-releases.
Pokémon Pinball: Like with EarthBound, not obvious to players, but it led the way for more realistic bounce-type physics. First popular video game with rumbling.

Nintendo 64: Made standard analog sticks and shoulder buttons. Confusing controller layout had room for improvement.
Super Mario 64: Completely redefined 3-D platformers (Compare this to Bubsy 3-D, for instance). Invented collect-a-thon platforming.
Mario Kart 64: First 3-D kart racer. Everyone wanted to make a clone of this game. Nintendo's approach to 3-D racetracks would forever become standard.
Star Fox 64: Popularized games with multiple endings. Introduced controller rumbling.
GoldenEye 007: Demonstrated first-person shooters can work on home consoles. Probably the reason Microsoft wanted Rareware so bad.
Mario Party: Invented the video board game.
Super Smash Bros.: Popularized mascot fighters. Most mascot fighters to this day are about ring-outs and cartoon violence.
Banjo-Tooie: Led the way for shadow and lighting effects.

Game Boy Advance: Horizontal scheme is now standard for all handheld gaming, including mobile gaming.
Advance Wars: Popularized strategy RPGs in the west.
Pokémon FireRed and LeafGreen: Brought infrared communication to handheld gaming.
WarioWare: Mega MicroGame$: Invented the microgame.
WarioWare: Twisted!: Introduced motion controls based on ball-bearing accelerometers. This same technology is used in the Wii Remote and most mobile devices.
Nintendo e-Reader: Precursor to QR Code system we see everywhere today.
Rhythm Tengoku: Simplified rhythm games to its barest. Is consistently quite popular in Japan.

Virtual Boy: An attempt at 3-D gaming. It would take several more years for Nintendo to get it right.
Mario Clash: An experimental but somewhat successful effort at making 3-D an integral part of a video game.

GameCube: Arguably the least innovative Nintendo system, and thus not remembered quite as fondly as its predecessors. But it did have some ideas.
Pikmin: Demonstrated army management games can work on home consoles.
Super Smash Bros. Melee: Accidentally demonstrated mascot fighters can have competitive gameplay. Pushed graphical detail of fighting games. First extensive use of orchestrated music in a video game.
Sonic Adventure 2 Battle: A show of goodwill between two former business rivals.
Phantasy Star Online (Gamecube version): Brought Gamecube online. Use was limited but well-liked. Gave ideas for how online gaming would work in the future.
Metroid Prime: Further reinforced the idea that first-person shooters can work on home consoles. Gritty atmosphere becomes inspiration for other developers. Retro Studios's breakout hit.
F-Zero GX: First major release to have connectivity between itself and an arcade title. F-Zero AX is the first major arcade release to have card-based game save systems, which is now standard in recent arcade releases.
Doubutsu no Mori (Animal Crossing): Popularized the feel-good, slow-paced game, though Harvest Moon has been doing it for some time.

Nintendo DS: First online Nintendo system. It beat out the PS3 and Xbox for being the first video game system to have online connectivity right out of the box. The two screens, while not widely imitated, at first confused develoeprs but they learned to like it. Touch screen is now standard in all handheld gaming.
Super Mario 64 DS: First 3-D platformer on a handheld system.
WarioWare: Touched!: Demonstrated what can be done with a touch screen and a second screen.
DS Navi: Demonstrated utility programs can work on handheld consoles. Precursor to non-game apps on mobile gaming today.
Brain Age: Train Your Brain in Minutes a Day!: Invented brain-training games. Still imitated today.
nintendogs: Popularized pet simulators on handheld gaming that isn't on an LCD screen.
Professor Layton and the Curious Village: Brought a string of imitators, either of the British gentleman protagonist or of brainteasers.
Mario Kart DS: First online Nintendo game. First online racing game.
Tetris DS: First online puzzle game. Tetris would forever be playable online from here on out.
New Super Mario Bros.: Revitalized 2-D platforming. Indie gaming being mostly 2-D platforming is due to this game.
Scribblenauts: Popularized family-oriented sandbox gaming. Breakout hit for 5th Cell.

Wii: There is no denying the impact this system had on video gaming. It created an expanded audience that crushed sales of its rivals. Motion controls would become an industry standard. The Virtual Console and WiiWare made all of its rivals have online libraries and is a precursor to Steam.
Wii Sports: Popularized motion controls. Is currently the top-selling non-mobile game in history. Popularized user avatars, previously done with Game Boy Camera.
WarioWare: Smooth Moves: Demonstrated all the different things that can be done with motion controls that were previously impossible.
Mario Kart Wii: Brought motion steering to console gaming.
Jett Rocket: Demonstrated what can be done with the 64MB limit of WiiWare: A complete, full-size 3-D platformer with up-to-date graphics and sound.
Wii Play: For better or for worse, popularized the mini-game collection type of game. Gameplay styles in this game would become common in mobile gaming.
Super Paper Mario: 2-D and 3-D switching would become an occasional but frequent game mechanic in indie gaming.
Zack & Wiki: Quest for Barbaros' Treasure: Capcom shows everyone how point-and-click can work with today's technology. Gets ball rolling on point-and-clicks.
Wii Music: While unsuccessful, the system used for user-generated content distribution would be utilized for future, better-selling games.
Animal Crossing: City Folk: Brought this genre of games (whatever it is) online.
Monster Hunter Tri: Popularized the monster-slaying game.
New Super Mario Bros. Wii: Proved that even the expanded audience, causal gamers if you prefer, could handle difficult games. Introduced gimmicks in 2-D platforming that would be copied endlessly from here on out.
Xenoblade Chronicles: Greatly expanded the scope of sandbox games. Nintendo of Europe's first big chance at localization and did it wonderfully.
Wii Sports Resort: Demonstrated what the Wii Motion Plus could do. Ideas have seeped into other companies and other media.

Nintendo 3DS: The 3-D of this system is underused, but not everyone can perceive it, so its limitedness is necessary. It is otherwise an improved DS, but it currently has a few new things of its own:
Mario Kart 7: Further streamlining of online play for racing games.
StreetPass Mii Plaza: First major release that uses pass-by data sharing.
Pokémon X and Y: Pushed graphical capabilities of the 3DS. Outdone again by OmegaRuby and Alpha Sapphire. First fully online Pokémon main-series game.
Style Savvy: Popularized the fashion game. Demonstrated that yes, a fashion game can be good if you put real talent and a good budget into it.
Yo-kai Watch: A phenomenon in Japan. Pokémon's first real competition in 18 years. Already has a multimedia empire. You can't spend more than 5 minutes in Japan without seeing Jibanyan somewhere.
Animal Crossing: New Leaf: I don't know what makes this one so very popular, but it cemented Animal Crossing as a first-tier Nintendo IP.
Shovel Knight: First indie breakout hit on a Nintendo system (Yacht Club). Paves the way for a series of indie games on the 3DS, such as Mutant Mudds.
Tomodachi Life: Re-popularized Sims-type gaming.
The Legend of Zelda: A Link Between Worlds: Updated classic Zelda-style gameplay to modern technology.

Wii U: The newest of Nintendo's systems, not too popular in the west but still pretty popular in Japan. (Please remember to check the links I gave--Wii U games regularly crack the top 5 weekly sales in Japan. There is no way you CAN'T consider that a success.) It has only recently found success though, so this list is a bit shorter than the others. The Wii U GamePad hasn't taken off quite as intended though:
Mario Kart 8: First Nintendo release to have extensive DLC. While not yet imitated by others extensively, this game's DLC system is said to be one of the best made.
Super Smash Bros. for Wii U: First combat game to segregate competitive and non-competitive players. (Previous games do this, but they were player-run.) First home console game to have YouTube integration.
Splatoon: Made third-person shooters accessible outside of the hardcore audience. First shooter to be a widespread success in Japan. Experimental drip-fed DLC system is currently incomplete; it's anyone's call how popular this will be in the future. This game, despite being out for less than a year, has already been imitated.
Super Mario Maker: Nintendo's first popular user-generated content game. Still too new to see how it stacks up to LittleBigPlanet in popularity or beginner-friendliness, but it does have the largest UGC collection online currently.

Nintendo more or less controls the video game business from behind the curtains. Almost everything standard in video games now can be traced back to Nintendo. (And I know I have some 3rd-party titles there, but they were all first released on Nintendo systems and can owe their success to Nintendo.)

this isn't about fitting in it's about having a community of people you deem as friends to chat with and play games with on the system and The NX Seriously needs to get on the boat with the community system that Xbox And Playstation have

There IS a community. One of them is right here.

 

[BlackZero]

this isn't about fitting in it's about having a community of people you deem as friends to chat with and play games with on the system and The NX Seriously needs to get on the boat with the community system that Xbox And Playstation have

Nintendo has quite a few of those. You happen to be the member of one currently.

you seem to think if someone disagrees with the way nintendo does things or believes they aren't really the console of choice for kids anymore that they have self esteem issues and are plagued by peer pressure to get the console that the media tells them to get...

I haven't said anything of the sort. Please re-read my posts. If there's anything I've said that isn't clear, just quote it and ask me to explain it further.

the wii-u is a console that can keep you entertained for awhile but eventually you gotta switch it up and go somewhere else it works fine as a secondary console but as anyone's only console or prime console it falls apart

An interesting opinion, but not really relevant to anything I've said. I don't think anyone will disagree that it's good to have variety. That's why I also have a PS3 and gaming PC.

it just doesn't have enough of what everyone wants to consider it before anything else

I'm not exactly sure what this means. No home console can have everything that everyone wants. For that, I still have to recommend a PC that you can customize to suit your gaming preferences. If you're expecting a console to have the same versatility and level of customization, you're in for a lot of disappointment.

i guess if you don't really have enough time to play video games(School/Work Perhaps?) it might work but for someone whose schedule is more flexible it just doesn't cut it

I think personal preference is a greater factor in this particular discussion than anything else. If you don't like the games Nintendo has, there's nothing wrong with that. Everyone is entitled to personal taste, and each person is different. Just have the confidence to say you like something else better rather than trying to justify your opinion by trivializing a company's accomplishments and professing that it's a sinking ship after slow year.

 

[Meechy2000]

Lol, I know the difference, I'm not entirely sure you're aware of how much your "claims" seemed like whining. But Hey, I must have misinterpreted it. I agree, Inklings were pretty good candidates for Smash, but that doesn't automatically mean they should have been added, and there's no reason to be upset, disappointed, angry, etc. because they weren't picked. There were hundreds of characters they should have added. To believe they should have added the one character you wanted simply because you or "thousands" of people wanted it is a bit selfish. They aren't Meechy Inc., they know what they're doing. Olimar didn't get added in Melee, it was a new IP yet it wasn't added, who knows why, but it wasn't. It's likely because they wanted that IP to develop and insure it was here to stay before they added it in Smash. Sure enough it stuck, and Olimar and soon Alph were added to the Smash Roster. This is not the first time that they refrained from adding a brand new IP into smash. Would it have been nice to see the Inklings? Absolutely, but it didn't happen. There's no reason, at all, to be disappointed. Nintendo does not cater exclusively to you, me, or anyone else in this Forum. I didn't get Isaac, who was a HUGE "icon". Golden Sun even has music in the game, he was an Assist trophy and everything. The recognition was there, yet they did nothing with it. I'm not upset or disappointed. Mainly because I understand that I'm not the sun and Nintendo isn't Earth.

I'm not attacking you dude, don't flatter yourself. You're not the only person I've replied to in this thread. Don't for a second, think I sit here waiting for you to reply so that I can point out the holes in your arguments. If these other "thousands" of people were here, I'd be doing the same thing to them. However, you're the only one quoting me, and arm barring me into responding.

So, again, don't flatter yourself.

Here,let me give you the definition of whining. Whining

1. give or make a long, high-pitched complaining cry or sound
2. Now let me give you the definition of a claim.
   claim
   verb
   1. state or assert that something is the case, typically without providing evidence or proof.
   noun
   1. an assertion of the truth of something, typically one that is disputed or in doubt.
   2. a demand or request for something considered one's due. Do you see the difference?You can not see nor hear me make a sound or noise so you can not say im so called "Whining".And this may not be Meechy inc but this is Nintendo and Nintendo job is to please the masses,NOW!Dont get me wrong,i never said they had to please everyone.BUT there job is to please a majority of people and ALOT of people are dissapointed that there is another FE character.And im pretty sire those people would have been happier if it was Shovel knight,Shantea,banjo kazooie,inklings ect.BUT,listen closely,I never said they should take any of the characters they added out of the game.Never came out my mouth BUT they could have still added another character and in my claim they should have added inklings or at the least a splatoon stage.Also i am not flattered at all i am stating that if its such a problem to you why dont you make a huge speech to the entire world to stop whinning.In my opinion its not a big deal.But it seems like your making a big deal out of it.If they are not talking bad towards you,if they are not talking about you why cant you just ignore it or let it go?Why do you have to take the time to tell a person to stop "whining"Over a opibion that has nothing to do with you?No matter what you do,no matter what you say my opinion will stay the same and everybody else opinion will stay the same.

 

[Cadet Strongarm]

Unless Someone Loves Small Indies PC Gaming Isn't for everyone

and by community i mean one that the system builds itself a community you gain through the games and consoles not a community made from some website

i met dozens upon dozens of people i talked with on ps3 without ever having to make my own message board or join a group session

i kinda want the same from nintendo...party chats and a reliable friend system that can give me all the details i want or would need

and while i cannot deny nintendo's innovative style the average gamer might judging by what sells the most and what's popular

and at the end of the day it doesn't matter how many bells and whistles you attach to your product if the average ordinary consumer has no interest in it then what's the use of being creative and innovative if the sales betray you?

Motion Controls were big thanks to the wii but it didn't take long for them to crash and burn after Microsoft and sony's attempts at copying the wii's success with the playstation move and kinect

I'll always have a special place in my heart for nintendo thanks to the gameboy pocket but that doesn't mean i can't see nintendo's current struggles to try and repeat last generation's phenomenal blockbuster hit that was the wii

 

[Pivi]

Wow, how'd we get to this topic? PCs are cool but i cant be a squid kid on one which is all I have to say about that lol

Anyway, for the Smash direct thing, Bayo was great but honestly, Corrin ruined the whole thing for me. I literally can't think of a worse possible choice.

It's so silly that they're trying to promote the new FE by adding a Smash character when regular advertisement is just as good and likely less expensive than the cost of creating an entire smash character from scratch, especially since FE: Fates is honestly waifu emblem and panders to the lowest denominator thanks to it's dating sim elements. You literally pet your units, like...Even without Corrin, Smash 4 is already filled with things from FE, even if you ignore the 5 FE characters, you have Chrom poking his head in at every other corner with a bunch of cameos and a Mii outfit. Not to mention, Fates came out a month after Splatoon, so the advertisement/promotion argument seems really sketchy even to someone who's #1 ballot pick wasn't even Inklings (RIP Ice Climbers :_;7)

I can't even forgive Corrin's unique moveset, by that argument, we should also get Lyn or Hector and be okay with it because their movesets would be original too, the issue is simply too much FE saturation.

The fact of the matter is that Sakurai played Awakening and really liked it (despite it being really lackluster in gameplay, story, characterization and just being a really poor SRPG overall-but thats another post) and is now stuffing Smash with FE characters while ignoring the requests for characters that people have been asking for since before Brawl.

It's just a frustrating thing to look at and deal with, I used to think people saying they hope Smash 5 has a different director were being excessive, but now I honestly see where they're coming from.

 

[Leronne]

I literally can't think of a worse possible choice.

Goku. It's not that hard to think of a worse character. But i do agree (except for the part about changing directors), there is a bit of FE over saturation. You also have to remember that this is the same director who brought pacman, megaman, ryu, cloud and bayonetta in.

And to everyone else:
CAN WE PLEASE GET BACK TO THE TOPIC AT HAND.
If you really want to have a console discussion, then make different freaking thread. This is the smash bros final direct discussion. I know i'm not a moderator and probably have no say in this, but this is getting really stupid, really annoying and really pointless -.-

 

[Litagano Motscoud]

Goku. It's not that hard to think of a worse character.

...is Goku really the worst character for Smash you can think of? Because I can see him fitting pretty well as a character, besides not really having a history with Nintendo.

 

[Of Moose & Men]

Here,let me give you the definition of whining. Whining

1. give or make a long, high-pitched complaining cry or sound.

Now let me give you the definition of whining you purposely left out because you realized it could possibly fit your "claim".

1.complain in a feeble or petulant way.

I'm not going to argue semantics dude. Leave it alone.

 

[Leronne]

...is Goku really the worst character for Smash you can think of? Because I can see him fitting pretty well as a character, besides not really having a history with Nintendo.

it's the first of many terrible characters that came to mind. he is the worse, not because he isn't a good character, but because he doesn't fit in smash bros at all. he's not a video game character, and smash is a battle royale for video game characters. and no, having a lot of video games (more video games than most of the smash roster) does not in any way make him a videogame character. he's a manga character.

 

[Flareth]

I get that Sakurai's a Fire Emblem fanboy, but ever since Corrin was revealed, I've had this nagging suspicion that he (Sakurai) may have been given a bit of a nudge by the higher ups to put him (Corrin) in to promote Fates.

Not that I'm complaining, though. I still think he looks crazy-cool to play as (lack of shoes aside). And, if my suspicion holds any weight, I don't think we'd be getting anybody else—from Fire Emblem or any other series.

 

[ILikeKirbys]

WARNING: THE FOLLOWING POST IS LONG

Anyway, for the Smash direct thing, Bayo was great

Bayonetta is great.

but honestly, Corrin ruined the whole thing for me. I literally can't think of a worse possible choice.

Alice from Balloon Quest, a Game Boy follow-up (I think) to Balloon Fight.
A small child whose entire gimmick was stolen by Villager's Up B.
Would be utterly pointless to include, even the original Balloon Fight guy (Balloon Fighter?) would probably work better since that's, y'know, a fighter of some sort (even if their whole gimmick was likewise used for Villager, I'm sure there's more to pull from for this one).

I get what you're saying tho, Corrin wouldn't've been high on my list of people to include in Sm4sh either.

It's so silly that they're trying to promote the new FE by adding a Smash character when regular advertisement is just as good and likely less expensive than the cost of creating an entire smash character from scratch,

I dunno, advertising your Nintendo game in the ultimate showdown of all things Nintendo seems like a wise marketing strategy if you don't piss too many people off, especially if the character you're advertising with ends up being well made and fun to play as.
And adding a character to Smash is a great way to give their series exposure, which they're probably hoping will lead to more sales for Fates. Worked pretty well with Marth and Roy back in Melee, led to their series being brought over (starting with the game after Roy's game, but still), and with Pit, who ended up getting a new (and quite good, once you get the hang of the controls) game after being brought back for Brawl.
I kinda wish the Ice Climbers got something like this too. Not like a big thing, maybe just a small downloadable game, just something. Ice Climbers made quite an impression on me from Smash.
I'm not a marketer tho, so I might be wrong.
And they'll probably do regular advertising too, closer to the release date.

especially since FE: Fates is honestly waifu emblem and panders to the lowest denominator thanks to it's dating sim elements. You literally pet your units, like...

Ah, isn't that only supposed to be one of the two versions? And isn't the other one supposed to be like one of the non-Awakening FEs?
I don't mean to go too far off topic, just wondering if that's not quite true.

Even without Corrin, Smash 4 is already filled with things from FE, even if you ignore the 5 FE characters, you have Chrom poking his head in at every other corner with a bunch of cameos and a Mii outfit.

Well, one of those cameos is in Robin's Final Smash, in a nice nod to Awakening's Pair Up mchanic...
And I think people expected him to get in over Ike (I did), and some of the Mii costumes were characters people hoped to see in Smash (K. Rool, Inklings, Geno, can't recall the others), so there's that explanation...
I do feel like there are one too many FE reps right now, but there's no way Lucina makes it to 5 (well, maybe as a Marth costume), and I'll bet either Corrin or Robin (hopefully Corrin, I like Robin) gets dropped from 5 too, so we're down to 4 reps (Marth/Roy/Ike/Robin or Corrin, though Corrin and Robin might both get kicked in favor of whoever the latest FE protag is. Happened to Roy), which is fine for a long runner like FE, at least I think so.

Not to mention, Fates came out a month after Splatoon, so the advertisement/promotion argument seems really sketchy even to someone who's #1 ballot pick wasn't even Inklings (RIP Ice Climbers :_;7)

Fates hasn't come out outside Japan yet, I don't think. Might be doing what they did with Roy (put him in to promote his upcoming game).

On another note, I miss Ice Climbers. Yeah, they only got cut due to technical limitations on the 3DS (at least, that's what I heard), so they'll probably be back for 5 (if Dr. Mario of all people can get cut and come back, then ICs shouldn't have a problem returning once technology lets Nintendo add them into 5), but it still sucks that they're gone.
Still kinda hope they get a new game someday.

I can't even forgive Corrin's unique moveset, by that argument, we should also get Lyn or Hector and be okay with it because their movesets would be original too, the issue is simply too much FE saturation.

Hector would probably just be Ike with an axe and no Aether (possibly a Hand Axe projectile tho), I can't justify putting him in.
Lyn I was really hoping would get into Brawl or 4, she actually probably would be unique in Sm4sh, but with this many FE reps now it'd just be too many.

The fact of the matter is that Sakurai played Awakening and really liked it (despite it being really lackluster in gameplay, story, characterization and just being a really poor SRPG overall-but thats another post) and is now stuffing Smash with FE characters while ignoring the requests for characters that people have been asking for since before Brawl.

Or he liked previous FEs as well, and this is just an easy way to aid a series he likes.
I'd do something like that, in his position (not so much for FE, you'd probably see Bandana Dee/Tom Nook/someone from Advance Wars, probably Andy or Sami, probably Sami/Alph-as-a-semi-clone-with-Rock-and-Winged-Pikmin-instead-of-Purple-and-White/Lloyd Irving/Mike Jones from StarTropics/Lyn/Adeline the painter girl from Kirby 64 from me).

It's just a frustrating thing to look at and deal with, I used to think people saying they hope Smash 5 has a different director were being excessive, but now I honestly see where they're coming from.

Well I hope Smash 5 gets a new director as well, but that's just because I want to see what whoever gets the position next will do with Smash.

I get that Sakurai's a Fire Emblem fanboy, but ever since Corrin was revealed, I've had this nagging suspicion that he (Sakurai) may have been given a bit of a nudge by the higher ups to put him (Corrin) in to promote Fates.

Yeah, I could see that having happened too. At least he got more effort put into him than Roy did the first time around (though I'm not sure who Corrin could've been a clone of...).

[QUOTE="Flareth, post: 136984, member: 11810"Not that I'm complaining, though. I still think he looks crazy-cool to play as (lack of shoes aside). And, if my suspicion holds any weight, I don't think we'd be getting anybody else—from Fire Emblem or any other series.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, it looks that way.
Until 5.
Then we get new guys.

And for an additional few things that might be related to the Final Smash direct...
How exactly does Limit Break (the blue aura) make Cloud better? I mean, besides one-time buffed specials and Finishing Touch, I remember hearing that it increased Cloud's stats a bit in the direct, but is it a significant amount? Because I didn't notice much when I was playing with him last night.
Also, Cloud's sword isn't quite as big as I was expecting. I'm a bit disappointed, though it's still quite good (and surprisingly quick).
Cloud is satisfying in general, though I keep thinking Down B will do a counterattack for some reason.

Finally, wasn't Snake prevented from using guns when he was in Brawl for some reason?
Why's Bayonetta allowed to keep hers?

 

[Of Moose & Men]

Lol, I will never understand how people can say it's "Waifu Emblem" now. That is a SMALL part of Fire Emblem. I mean, yea, they added the marriage system, but it is in no way the entire purpose of the game. It's not a dating simulator, it's an extremely story driven game. I mean, if Fire Emblem Awakening and Fates are Waifu simulator, so is Skyrim.

Such a "go to" wolf cry.

 

[Leronne]

Finally, wasn't Snake prevented from using guns when he was in Brawl for some reason?
Why's Bayonetta allowed to keep hers?

i guess the "time's have changed" argument fits here. maybe nintendo was strict in the past, but is more lenient this time around

 

[Cadet Strongarm]

When Fire emblem has more characters than Zelda And Pokemon you know something's off

 

[Of Moose & Men]

When Fire emblem has more characters than Zelda And Pokemon you know something's off

It doesn't have more than Pokemon, they both have the same amount. Zelda only has so many characters though, at least the ones that have a place in Smash Bros. I wouldn't mind Impa I'll admit, but that's it. I mean, they could add Tetra, Pig Ganon and Toon Ganon, but then we'd be having the same problem of "clones" taking over Smash. I agree that there are a lot of FE characters, but it's odd how no one complained when more Pokemon were added isn't it?

Oh the irony. It's only a problem when it's a character people don't personally prefer.

 

[Cadet Strongarm]

no it's only a problem when it just means more sword wielders stabbing you in the face

 

[PrinceOfKoopas]

If Ike wasn't in Smash 4 then the entire Fire Emblem representation there wouldn't be worth having.

Awakening isn't a story-driven game. The story (especially it's story-telling) is a total joke, and even the developers acknowledged that in the Iwata Asks for Fire Emblem: Fates.