Personal opinions on buffs/nerfs that should happen

[Kaliafornia]

Lots of weapons are fine as is IMO, there are a few which i would change (Nozzlenose needs more ink coverage, swap subs with the e-litre vanilla and custom sets so pure damage e-litre builds won't be that dominating anymore, ect)

On the other hand, abilities IMO need some tweaking:

: For reasons everyone said already, essential whenever you're playing roller or charger it's too good. I'd rather have it be that a portion of this perk would instead be active w/o choosing ink resist.

They already nerfed this once. It's so-so now. The only way this is an issue now is if there is lag.

: This one should not exist, ever. It makes just as much sense as a soundproof perk to make yourself immune to killer wail, everyone picks this just to counter echolocator and not point sensor/lolhaunt and if none of the enemy has tracking it's a wasted slot. Ideal would be to nerf all tracking slightly and remove this perk entirely, but i don't think that's possible anymore.

It cuts time down in half. Still lasts long enough for enemy to get a good sense of where you are. Half the time people don't use echolocator weapons anymore (unless its an E-liter) so its possible to be in games where it doesn't get any use at all. It's the most useful for disrupter though since you literally cant do much of anything but die.

: Haunt isn't used b/c of the aforementioned cold-blooded, which sucks b/c it isn't a bad ability especially if you happen to get ambushed and you want to warn others. If cold blooded is here to stay, it should at least be less affected by it.

Haunt isn't used mostly because it's pretty useless. It's useless when with randoms and you would be better benefited by using other abilities and tell your team member when you died via call in competitive. It cuts locator time in half, but like I said before its enough time to get a feel for where people are.

: Needs to save more, period. Compared to main saver it just doesn't hold up.

Your sub isn't supposed to be used as a main weapon. It's just useful to have so when you do use a splash wall for instance you aren't completely out of ink.

: At the moment, it saves far too little whenever you get splat, considering splats shouldn't happen that often while perks like charge up stays active all the time. It really needs a (very) strong buffing.

Charge up only boosts you when actively spreading ink though. I used to think charge up was better too but in high splat games like tower or rainmaker, it will save more as it will still take you longer with the charge up boost to keep refilling meter.

 

[Karonax]

it's almost a skill-less weapon as the only necessary information to use it effectively is the correct place to stand on every map and repetitively fling down into crucial areas.

As a Dynamo main I can tell you that's certainly not true.

We have to get a grasp on the very specific distances it takes to make sure we aren't in range of getting shot but we can still hit them, as well as the distance where our flicks will actually be effective since only hitting with a single glop only does 25 damage. We have to be careful on when we take our swings as well because a good opponent won't give us time to wind-up for a second if we miss, particularly because the way our flicks arc, it's easy to go right over the target's head. Bad Dynamos are pretty obvious and easy to kill once you know how the Dynamo operates.

Too many players have the mentality of go-go-go whenever they see an enemy, and usually die trying to rush us down. It's pretty easy to see a Dynamo because we hop before our long swing wind-up, which is something most other rollers don't do. It's really about baiting an exploitable response because of our high commitment. Hell, if we wind-up after you've thrown a grenade, we're finished.

If we have the advantage of height or surrounded by our own ink, that's not a Dynamo only advantage. Any enemy who has the high ground is immediately at an advantage because they can hit you while you can't hit them as easily. Honestly, a good Charger or Splatling are far better at holding ground then we will ever be. I usually can't beat a good Splatling, close range or not, at best we trade.

I'd say our biggest weaknesses are Chargers (obviously), Splatlings (dat range), good Tentateks & Jr.s (if we miss, we die), Squelcher (surprise! unexpectedly out-ranged), but also the Krak-On has a very good means to counter us because it can cut through our ink and kills us during our wind-ups. Some of the most common weapons really.

Like any weapon we have our weaknesses, it just takes using a bit of patience, which is hard in a fast-paced game sometimes, especially for less experienced players. We don't auto-win, especially not in ranked, they dodge our initial shot and we're dead before we can wind a second.

 

[MrL1193]

They already nerfed this once. It's so-so now. The only way this is an issue now is if there is lag.

Even with the nerf, Ink Resistance still seems overly centralizing. It's just really hard to justify picking another ability for your shoes (with the possible exception of Stealth Jump) because Ink Resistance is still a huge benefit.

It cuts time down in half. Still lasts long enough for enemy to get a good sense of where you are. Half the time people don't use echolocator weapons anymore (unless its an E-liter) so its possible to be in games where it doesn't get any use at all. It's the most useful for disrupter though since you literally cant do much of anything but die.

For the record, it doesn't halve the tracking time; it quarters it. Yes, tracking attacks still point out your general location, but any chance for the enemy team to actually leverage the advantage in a fight is gone. As a dedicated hard counter, Cold Blooded does its job very well.

 

[River09]

The big problem there would be that Echo would easily become the best special in the entire game if you significantly nerf Cold-Blooded.
Giving CB only %25 reduction would make it useless. You also have to keep in mind CB only (heavily) affects a few instances where you'll be tracked, whereas other abilities have a more widespread effect. Which is why i wonder CB even exists, if it's just stops one special from being overpowered when you can nerf the special in the first place.

That is true but right now the meta is extremely favouring CB atm. Either Echolocator or CB needs a nerf imo.

 

[Agosta44]

Ink Resist is still over centralizing. The nerf barely did anything outside of increasing damage taken, which isn't even the reason it's so good.

 

[Kaliafornia]

Even with the nerf, Ink Resistance still seems overly centralizing. It's just really hard to justify picking another ability for your shoes (with the possible exception of Stealth Jump) because Ink Resistance is still a huge benefit.

I suppose. Although without it being stopped by 1 pixel of enemy ink and being able to to be OHKO by a multi-shot weapon is annoying. Even with ink resistance on the enemy, 1v1 if you get the jump on someone from a distance that is advantageous to your weapon, you still should be able to kill them (unless there is lag) reliably each time. Especially so if you have any movement up speeds as you will be able to out maneuver them even more no question.

For the record, it doesn't halve the tracking time; it quarters it. Yes, tracking attacks still point out your general location, but any chance for the enemy team to actually leverage the advantage in a fight is gone. As a dedicated hard counter, Cold Blooded does its job very well.

I didn't mean to infer that cold blooded wasn't good. It's great. However, the echolocator still is lasting long enough with cold blooded so your position is given away if you were about to launch a surprise attack or cut off a chokepoint, so the enemy is expecting you and you have to rethink your strat. Cold blooded is just not allowing you to be hunted or tracked from a considerable distance or for that matter an easy sniper shot if you move from cover. I think it's a fair trade, considering like I said it's not common for echolocator to be in every single match or if it is how often it will be used and if you will even be affected (you could be dead/respawning when it was activated so its not tracking you anyway).

 

[Box]

Cold blooded probably should have never existed in the first place because it makes balancing the tracking weapons really hard to do. But now that it's in the game, I think it should be nerfed from 75% reduction to 50%. To accommodate, echo could be rebalanced to 8 seconds from 12. Point sensor can stay at 10.

I also think the Ink Mine should have a manual detonate when you press the button a second time. It might need further buffs but the inability to use your sub weapon if put it in the wrong place is a huge hindrance.

 

[Xeiros]

There's no way to make the Echolocator useful without taking away the cold blooded interaction it currently has going on. The entire reason it's allowed to be as good as it is currently is precisely because there's an ability that hard counters it. That is the only thing holding it back. In exchange for a number of features/benefits no other special offers an optional hard counter was implemented to keep it in check.

Over twice the duration of any other special? Check. It's also the only special whose meter can by built while the special itself is still active allowing for potential back to back uses. Plus it's the only one that has its effects passed onto the rest of the team regardless of their location unlike say the bubbler. It also doesn't replace your main weapon nor encourage you to spam your sub weapon while it's active, so it doubles as a fast ink refill.

A single use is all it takes for team wide enemy intelligence so precise getting flanked becomes a thing of the past. The final cherry on top comes when a user discovers that if they were to say activate their echo, but get splatted shortly after, it'll remain active even after they've revived. Not even death itself can put on damper on its duration.

It has all those advantages over other specials again because Cold Blooded exists. No one in a serious competitive environment would tolerate it otherwise. Echolocator is a legal wall hack. I would like to think we all know how powerful a wall hack can be in a shooter. That one ability is the only thing stopping it from being grossly overpowered. It would be a staple on every team as a meta defining special. It would define the basis for how players approached combat. It's difficult to catch anyone off guard via flanking when they know exactly where you are potentially the entire match. So really it's fine as is. I'm clueless as to how you could make it useful without the need for a limiter ability partnership.

 

[EmLeingod]

I'm new to Splat, but I'm curious as to why you guys think that Ink Res is so good that it straight invalidates Stealth Jump?

 

[Karonax]

I'm new to Splat, but I'm curious as to why you guys think that Ink Res is so good that it straight invalidates Stealth Jump?

It significantly reduces how badly enemy ink effects you if you go into it. For instance if you're traveling and you hit a small patch of enemy ink, without Ink Resistance it grinds you to a halt, where as having it allows you to go over it with minimal slowdown.

Having access to more mobility gives you more options, more options means better/stronger plays.

Stealth Jump is handy, but only really useful when jumping to an ally under fire/in enemy territory, which when you land if you're in an enemy ink patch your lack of mobility means you're very likely dead.

 

[Noise Tank]

Most short ranged rapid fire weapons have lower skill ceilings. If you seriously wanted to introduce someone to Splatoon and they asked which weapon to start out with the Dynamo just wouldn't be close. Heck, all other rollers are easier to get into. The mobility is the main reason alongside the fact that you can't spam attacks like other weapons.

idk why you're replying if you don't know what "skill ceiling" means

Here is the ancient chinese secret to pro status with the dynamo:

1. Hide at a high traffic area
2. jump flick
3. kill anyone within a 1 mile radius
4. repeat

 

[Karonax]

1. Hide at a high traffic area
2. jump flick
3. kill anyone within a 1 mile radius
4. repeat

That only works against inexperienced players/Turf War; Try that strategy in the higher ranks and see how it goes.

 

[Noise Tank]

That only works against inexperienced players/Turf War; Try that strategy in the higher ranks and see how it goes.

uh works just fine for me in S+ rank games, and I hardly have any turf inked with any roller.

 

[Karonax]

uh works just fine for me in S+ rank games, and I hardly have any turf inked with any roller.

Simply stating "I'm S+" doesn't hold any weight on an opinion, anybody on the internet can say that.

You're going to need a stronger explanation than that for me to believe you. I'm only A+ with it, give me some tips. Simply sitting there flinging ink in a single spot will get you killed by opponents exploiting your blind spots, which most good opponents do, how do you cover your position? You have some specifics on what game mode and map you're talking about? How do you handle Chargers and Splatlings in those settings? How do you cover between Dynamo wind-ups when you miss? How does that work in a game mode where the objective is moving (Tower/Rainmaker)? Your strategy seems to only imply that it works when you can stand still and fling down from a higher choke point which works in maybe 3-4 maps, what about the others?

 

[Kaliafornia]

I'm new to Splat, but I'm curious as to why you guys think that Ink Res is so good that it straight invalidates Stealth Jump?

Agreed with whats been said but I would also say the only time Stealth Jump is really good is on Tower Control as if you can jump after the enemy takes it you can surprise them, kill a few and retake the tower. Although Stealth Jumping can be advantageous, if you SJ into a firefight chances are you are going to die, even if your teammate gets the jump on the enemy and kills them. There is a delay on what the map looks like when you chose that teammate to jump to and when you actually get there, an even longer one with the stealth feature added. Even if the jump is safe your map awareness is low and you wouldn't have seen the enemy hiding like you would have if you approached the battle from further away.

If you really want to incorporate SJ get a "pure" SJ gear, I'm not sure the seconds on it but I can SJ lightening fast and beat or comedown at the same time as a teammate who is already SJing ahead of you. I still would be very selective on where you choose to SJ but getting there faster is better than slower imo as the map will be more true to when you decided to jump.

uh works just fine for me in S+ rank games, and I hardly have any turf inked with any roller.

Sure but there is a lot more skill that goes into it besides how simple you made it seem. If you are S+ then you had to have great map awareness, know the strengths and weaknesses of your weapon as well as other weapons you engage. I'd say it has less to master than other weapons utility wise but there is a larger learning curve for beginning players. It's part of the reason you have to beat story mode for it.

 

[Noise Tank]

Simply stating "I'm S+" doesn't hold any weight on an opinion, anybody on the internet can say that.

You're going to need a stronger explanation than that for me to believe you. I'm only A+ with it, give me some tips. Simply sitting there flinging ink in a single spot will get you killed by opponents exploiting your blind spots, which most good opponents do, how do you cover your position? You have some specifics on what game mode and map you're talking about? How do you handle Chargers and Splatlings in those settings? How do you cover between Dynamo wind-ups when you miss? How does that work in a game mode where the objective is moving (Tower/Rainmaker)? Your strategy seems to only imply that it works when you can stand still and fling down from a higher choke point which works in maybe 3-4 maps, what about the others?

I'm not here to write up some in depth guide on all the ways you can jump and flick with it. I can link you to the guides section if that's what you were looking for.

The fact that my "strategy" even works at all is a testament to how easy it is to master the dynamo. If you want to see screencaps or something of my games with it, pm me if you don't believe me I guess.

Sure but there is a lot more skill that goes into it besides how simple you made it seem. If you are S+ then you had to have great map awareness, know the strengths and weaknesses of your weapon as well as other weapons you engage. I'd say it has less to master than other weapons utility wise but there is a larger learning curve for beginning players. It's part of the reason you have to beat story mode for it.

Outside of fundamental shooter skills, you don't really need anything more to get good with the dynamo. Half my kills come from people I don't even know are there, so you barely even need the fundamentals really.

 

[Karonax]

I'm not here to write up some in depth guide on all the ways you can jump and flick with it. I can link you to the guides section if that's what you were looking for.

"Here, because guides exist for this weapon, obviously it takes no skill."

I didn't ask those questions because I don't know to play, I asked to make sure you knew what you were talking about.

An undefined strategy and "No skill needed because the Dynamo is OP" with no explanation other than 'It is" is not a compelling argument. Examples please, preferably specific game modes, maps, and where on the maps. I want to know WHY you think it's overpowered, I know you think it is, but make me understand with in-depth analysis.

This thread is about discussing nerfs and buffs and specific reasons why, if you can't constructively discuss the finer details of your claims it's hard to consider it worthwhile.

 

[Noise Tank]

I want to know WHY you think it's overpowered, I know you think it is

Obviously you don't because I never said it was. It doesn't take "no skill" either. I've played against crappy to good dynamos. Like I implied in my first post on this page, it just has a very low skill ceiling. Combine that with the ridiculous power and range, it's no wonder it's so popular among rng scrubs. I wouldn't be surprised if they lowered the ohko range at some point.

If you want an example, I can do this all match and completely dominate the middle no problem:

http://webm.host/a0f9b/

 

[Karonax]

it just has a very low skill ceiling

Hmm, it does seem like I misinterpreted what you said a little bit on my end after re-reading things. Probably doesn't help that I'm biased as a Dynamo main myself, so I probably came off a bit too defensive.

Though what do you mean by RNG scrubs? I haven't heard the term in context to Splatoon.

 

[Noise Tank]

Though what do you mean by RNG scrubs? I haven't heard the term in context to Splatoon.

as in the randoms you get paired up with online that you usually suck and usually gravitate towards easy weapons in order to compete. They're in almost every online shooter..