Banning Weapons or Maps?

[iDaylon]

I'm not sure. We'll have to see I guess.

We will, won't we? :)

optimistically, yes

realistically, i'm not so sure. i think they will, considering they've made attempts at balancing smash and mk8, and they're pushing splatoon as a game that appeals to casual and serious players alike. the answer at the moment, though, is unclear

They haven't really done much to mk8 other than online stability and fixing latency in some aspects of the game. I'm sure you're quite acquainted with the term firehopping, correct? Very controversial topic back in the early months of the game. Some hated it and some liked it. If Nintendo cared about the community's concerns, they would have done something to accommodate both sides of the community but they didn't. That's what I'm not very optimistic toward Nintendo doing anything if something like banning weaponry/maps were to arise.

 

[FunkyLobster]

We will, won't we? :)


They haven't really done much to mk8 other than online stability and fixing latency in some aspects of the game. I'm sure you're quite acquainted with the term firehopping, correct? Very controversial topic back in the early months of the game. Some hated it and some liked it. If Nintendo cared about the community's concerns, they would have done something to accommodate both sides of the community but they didn't. That's what I'm not very optimistic toward Nintendo doing anything if something like banning weaponry/maps were to arise.

i know what firehopping is, as well as demonsliding (although i'm still unsure of how to pull THAT tech off :/)

the thing is those techniques aren't really problematic, it's just something that raises the skill ceiling, and people who pull the off are gonna get a lot of VR and eventually get into matchmaking with people who use those techniques, too

and nintendo has changes the RNG behind item boxes over time, i believe patch 3.0 made red shells more common and blue shells less likely. correct me if i'm wrong on the specifics, but they definitely have made attempts at balancing mk8 over time

 

[Atratus]

The thought of bans even being a discussion this early on in the game's life is not something that should even be considered right now.

The game needs to have at least a few months time of being around before things like that can be discussed. I seriously want to avoid any Smash 4 Custom instances again where sets were made way too early and lock out potential before it really is there.

 

[FunkyLobster]

The thought of bans even being a discussion this early on in the game's life is not something that should even be considered right now.

The game needs to have at least a few months time of being around before things like that can be discussed. I seriously want to avoid any Smash 4 Custom instances again where sets were made way too early and lock out potential before it really is there.

i agree. the game's not even out yet and there's nothing we've seen that's outlandishly overpowered, so i think any talks about bans are premature

that said, i think discussing how we go about banning equipment and weapons, should it come to that, is perfectly appropriate, which seems to be what's happening in this thread

 

[Platypudding]

Banning anything would be psycho unless it was like specials weapons altogether or something which wouldn't be a good idea either. This isn't smash bros people...

Well, of course it's not Smash Bros, but the things that are banned in Smash are all reasonable (at least in melee, I don't pay a whole lot of attention to competitive smash 4, though its ruleset seems justified to me.)

As a competitive community, we need to be prepared to find and modify or ban things that bring up problems in competitive play. Balance issues are extremely likely to come up in Splatoon, as it's a game mostly designed for casual play. There could be parts of the game that just don't really work for competitive play. And that's fine. But we should be prepared for these things.

 

[Atratus]

Going about banning also seems just as bad as a discussion topic right now, don't you think? We do that and then the whole meta gets shifted before it can be organically created.

Discussing going about how to ban things with nothing but hypotheticals as a basis doesn't seem conducive to anything positive, at least for a little bit. We can't know HOW to ban anything if we don't know anything right now. We have to see the organic flow of the game first to discuss that.

As a competitive community, we need to be prepared to find and modify or ban things that bring up problems in competitive play.

Yes, and let those that have the actual talents and skills needed to make the meta dictate that rather than armchair warriors. This is coming from someone in competitive gaming for a while. I don't want to see anything harm this game before anything can come about.

 

[Lyn]

Well, of course it's not Smash Bros, but the things that are banned in Smash are all reasonable (at least in melee, I don't pay a whole lot of attention to competitive smash 4, though its ruleset seems justified to me.)

As a competitive community, we need to be prepared to find and modify or ban things that bring up problems in competitive play. Balance issues are extremely likely to come up in Splatoon, as it's a game mostly designed for casual play. There could be parts of the game that just don't really work for competitive play. And that's fine. But we should be prepared for these things.

I do agree. Hopefully this wont be an issue, but things like this do pop up in games.

 

[FunkyLobster]

Going about banning also seems just as bad as a discussion topic right now, don't you think? We do that and then the whole meta gets shifted before it can be organically created.

Discussing going about how to ban things with nothing but hypotheticals as a basis doesn't seem conducive to anything positive, at least for a little bit. We can't know HOW to ban anything if we don't know anything right now. We have to see the organic flow of the game first to discuss that.

Yes, and let those that have the actual talents and skills needed to make the meta dictate that rather than armchair warriors. This is coming from someone in competitive gaming for a while. I don't want to see anything harm this game before anything can come about.

i agree with that last point, let's leave it up to the inevitable splatoon backroom to decide on bans and let the meta shift into something healthy. let's not ban weapons too preemptively once the game comes out

 

[WaifuRaccoonBL]

I think it is entirely possible. Though, the more concerning thing is combinations with equipment.

With that said, I don't expect anything too broken, and we might not even need to if the Splatoon development team are good with Balance patches. Hopefully we don't freak out over the tinniest strong thing and try our best to find counter strategies.

Banning is still a last resort after all.

Maps...Hmm...I'm not sure there is really going to be a bad map unless there is actually a possibility of stalling, (which I doubt with this kind of game). I fully expect all maps to be legal.

 

[FunkyLobster]

there's actually no discussion on maps on this thread yet

i hope that lobbies have a vote system for maps like most games do, so players don't have to play on the worse maps in the game

the only maps i would think to see banned are maps with a lot of hazards like water, or maps with weird imbalance like not much high ground, or too centralized on killing other players instead of taking the objective

the maps in this game all look really good actually. i don't expect any to get bans

 

[Platypudding]

Going about banning also seems just as bad as a discussion topic right now, don't you think? We do that and then the whole meta gets shifted before it can be organically created.

Discussing going about how to ban things with nothing but hypotheticals as a basis doesn't seem conducive to anything positive, at least for a little bit. We can't know HOW to ban anything if we don't know anything right now. We have to see the organic flow of the game first to discuss that.



Yes, and let those that have the actual talents and skills needed to make the meta dictate that rather than armchair warriors. This is coming from someone in competitive gaming for a while. I don't want to see anything harm this game before anything can come about.

Sure, we don't have much info currently, but I don't think the attitude of "why even talk about this right now" is unhealthy for general discussion. Nobody's trying to outright ban anything yet. We're not being armchair warriors, we're discussing things that could potentially cause problems in a competitive meta game. No bad will come of this discussion, and it could even cause some good! There's no need to silence discussion on a forum specifically for such a thing.

 

[Lyn]

the maps in this game all look really good actually. i don't expect any to get bans

Same. There's always the chance of off maps that have ridiculous or unfair hazards, although that seems very unlikely.

 

[WaifuRaccoonBL]

there's actually no discussion on maps on this thread yet

i hope that lobbies have a vote system for maps like most games do, so players don't have to play on the worse maps in the game

the only maps i would think to see banned are maps with a lot of hazards like water, or maps with weird imbalance like not much high ground, or too centralized on killing other players instead of taking the objective

the maps in this game all look really good actually. i don't expect any to get bans

Even with lots of hazards I wouldn't expect any to be ban worthy. Unlike Smash bros, it'll be verrrry hard for any of them to be intrusive, which is the primarily reason for banning.

I also hope for a voting system.

 

[Platypudding]

Same. There's always the chance of off maps that have ridiculous or unfair hazards, although that seems very unlikely.

The general map design in the game seems very straightforward, simple, and obviously balanced. I'm interested in seeing how maps might affect weapon choice! I highly doubt any of them will be worth a ban.

 

[Mr. Squidward Tennisballs]

The general map design in the game seems very straightforward, simple, and obviously balanced. I'm interested in seeing how maps might affect weapon choice! I highly doubt any of them will be worth a ban.

Same, I'm sure they made every map with every weapon in mind.

 

[Regiruler]

Banning individual stages or gear pieces would cause too much friction early on in the game's life between the community and any official tournament offerings put forth by Nintendo.

A standard gear for tournaments might be beneficial though. No need to be selective with what's allowed, just ban all sets but one.

 

[Lyn]

Banning individual stages or gear pieces would cause too much friction early on in the game's life between the community and any official tournament offerings put forth by Nintendo.

A standard gear for tournaments might be beneficial though. No need to be selective with what's allowed, just ban all sets but one.

I don't think we should ban everything right away, but if gear is overpowered I don't see why it should be allowed, honestly. Forcing one set also is really bad for meta unless we are having arena tournaments which is a whole 'nother story, especially since Splatoon isn't an arena shooter.

 

[Regiruler]

I meant cosmetic set: hat/chest/shoes. Not weapon set. Those should be inherently balanced to one another anyway.

 

[Lyn]

Ah, okay. That makes sense.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Just wait.

Too early to say anything regarding to bans.