Final Smash Presentation Discussion

[Flareth]

no it's only a problem when it just means more sword wielders stabbing you in the face

And having people use a sword is an issue because...?

Seriously, of all the complaints I've heard about Smash 4, this is honestly the one I can't make sense of at all. So what if 11 or so characters use swords? What, you think every single swing looks the same? What about the 40 or so characters that just use their fists/feet? There's a bit of overlap in moves among those characters, is there not? So why isn't that a problem?

Please, enlighten me. I'm serious. Because I cannot for the life of me figure it out myself.

 

[Cadet Strongarm]

i would just like some more variety in weapon users i guess....this isn't soul calibur

 

[Flareth]

...well, it's not a good reason, but it's a reason.

New question: would you be still be complaining if there were 11 or so shooter-type characters?

 

[Cadet Strongarm]

...well, it's not a good reason, but it's a reason.

New question: would you be still be complaining if there were 11 or so shooter-type characters?

uh yeah because this isn't a shooter/fighter hybrid like some sort of call of duty streets

 

[Flareth]

I see.

Well then, do you suggest we cut everybody that uses a sword and just have everybody be a brawler?

(I know I'm prying, but I want to see exactly where you stand on this. Don't take it personally.)

 

[Cadet Strongarm]

I see.

Well then, do you suggest we cut everybody that uses a sword and just have everybody be a brawler?

(I know I'm prying, but I want to see exactly where you stand on this. Don't take it personally.)

i don't suggest that...I'm just saying we don't need to overload on the swords and shield vibe here

all fire emblem characters end up looking the same to me anyways because at the end of the day it's just another person swinging and slashing a sword

 

[DarkGold777]

i don't suggest that...I'm just saying we don't need to overload on the swords and shield vibe here

all fire emblem characters end up looking the same to me anyways because at the end of the day it's just another person swinging and slashing a sword

Swords are common weapons in modern media alongside fists, guns, energy-esque attacks, and magic.

BTW, in FE, there are A BUNCH of characters who use lances, axes, or magic instead, alongside beings who can transform. Do the research next time before making assumptions.

And isn't there only so few characters who use shields?

 

[Cadet Strongarm]

and yet we just got the sword users in Smash...go figure hell i would have loved an axe wielder or a lance in smash instead of just swords swords and more swords

 

[Zombie Aladdin]

Not to mention, Fates came out a month after Splatoon, so the advertisement/promotion argument seems really sketchy even to someone who's #1 ballot pick wasn't even Inklings (RIP Ice Climbers :_;7)

Major difference: Fire Emblem: Fates is a sequel to a time-tested and proven IP. Nintendo could be reasonably confident it would sell. Splatoon is a new IP. No one could tell whether it'd succeed or fail when it came out. The fact that Splatoon merchandise took this long to be made is proof of that.

i guess the "time's have changed" argument fits here. maybe nintendo was strict in the past, but is more lenient this time around

My guess is that Bayonetta's firearms are supernatural and used in unconventional ways. Realistic firearms are out, but fantasy ones are fine. Otherwise, we wouldn't have the laser gun weapon, the Super Scope 6, the Star Fox characters' blasters, or half of Duck Hunt's gimmick.

 

[Meechy2000]

Now let me give you the definition of whining you purposely left out because you realized it could possibly fit your "claim".

1.complain in a feeble or petulant way.

I'm not going to argue semantics dude. Leave it alone.

I did not leave out anything,I literally copied that from google.Search it up on google and it gives you only one definition which is the one i copied and pasted.And your definition has a 1 on it and mine have a 1 on it so if there was more then 1 definition one of ours would have a 2 on it.

 

[Of Moose & Men]

I did not leave out anything,I literally copied that from google.Search it up on google and it gives you only one definition which is the one i copied and pasted.And your definition has a 1 on it and mine have a 1 on it so if there was more then 1 definition one of ours would have a 2 on it.

Is this really what we're resorting to?

Spoiler: We're really doing this?

I simply put a one out of sarcasm. Wasted my time.

 

[Meechy2000]

[QUOE]="Of Moose & Men, post: 137117, member: 7755"]Is this really what we're resorting to?

Spoiler: We're really doing this?

View attachment 2462

I simply put a one out of sarcasm. Wasted my time.[/QUOTE]
Definition of feeble acking physical strength, especially as a result of age or illness. Definition of petulant childishly sulky or bad-tempered. My claim was not any of those things.But the second definition didnt pop up maybe cause my phone is slow and dumb.My claim cant be childish in anyway because its not a fact.And im not sick at all so my claim was not whining.

 

[Pivi]

Lol, I will never understand how people can say it's "Waifu Emblem" now. That is a SMALL part of Fire Emblem. I mean, yea, they added the marriage system, but it is in no way the entire purpose of the game. It's not a dating simulator, it's an extremely story driven game. I mean, if Fire Emblem Awakening and Fates are Waifu simulator, so is Skyrim.

Such a "go to" wolf cry.

I think if you ask anyone whos been a longtime fan of FE, they'd get the term Waifu Emblem. The game has has supports and marriage and I think even the kids coming from the future thing before in the series, but the fact of the matter is that FE as a series, even with all the help Smash gave it, was LITERALLY on life support until Awakening came out, and if it didn't sell, the series would be finished, at which point the pandering/dating sim/ect parts went full force.

The issue with Awakening is that it put so much effort into the support conversations, that every other aspect of the game suffered. I honestly can't tell you what the story was about because it was so barebones and forgettable, Chrom is probably the blandest main character I've ever seen (Robin gets away with it since they're the self insert), the game itself fails as an SRPG since the pair up mechanic turns the Rock/Paper/Scissors gameplay into a "just bunch all your strong guys together and they'll get away unscathed", the non-main characters are all so one note it hurts, you can't tell me much about Gregor except that he's just a cheery assassin with an accent, and that's all he is. same with just about every other character (inigo was pretty good tho but anyways) All the important story deaths (Aversa, Wallheart, Emmeryn ect) literally didn't matter since you get them all back in postgame for the sole purpose of marrying them. The story aspect of FE:A completely succumbs to the support system so much so that there isn't much of a point to even playing the game when the support conversations are uploaded on Youtube.

I say ALL of that to say that Fates is going to me more of the same, but even worse because now they have the niche market who doesn't care about the quality of the game, as long as they get their waifus. More forgettable story, more bland characters who exist for the sole purpose of you trying to date them, and more pandering and face petting. Like, in Corrin's trailer, you had the loli-type character going "Big Brother!!" over and over. You can instantly tell what her entire character is going to be just from a simple voice over, and the thing is, that's going to be the case with just about every character in Fates.

Awakening and Fates are bad games that sell because of mass pandering and otaku blood money, they're now in the same league as games like Hyperdimensial Neptunia and Senran. Corrin represents all of this and that's why Corrin is an awful choice and why I can't find any reason to be excited for him, cool moveset or not.

 

[Of Moose & Men]

Definition of feeble acking physical strength, especially as a result of age or illness. Definition of petulant childishly sulky or bad-tempered. My claim was not any of those things.But the second definition didnt pop up maybe cause my phone is slow and dumb.My claim cant be childish in anyway because its not a fact.And im not sick at all so my claim was not whining.

Lol, that's not how that works. But I'm not continuing this.

 

[Elecmaw]

*nervously raises hand*

h-hey guys, can we go back to the actual topic
please

 

[Meechy2000]

*nervously raises hand*

h-hey guys, can we go back to the actual topic
please

well this is the smash presentation thread soooooo i am on topic.

 

[BlackZero]

I think if you ask anyone whos been a longtime fan of FE, they'd get the term Waifu Emblem. The game has has supports and marriage and I think even the kids coming from the future thing before in the series, but the fact of the matter is that FE as a series, even with all the help Smash gave it, was LITERALLY on life support until Awakening came out, and if it didn't sell, the series would be finished, at which point the pandering/dating sim/ect parts went full force.

The issue with Awakening is that it put so much effort into the support conversations, that every other aspect of the game suffered. I honestly can't tell you what the story was about because it was so barebones and forgettable, Chrom is probably the blandest main character I've ever seen (Robin gets away with it since they're the self insert), the game itself fails as an SRPG since the pair up mechanic turns the Rock/Paper/Scissors gameplay into a "just bunch all your strong guys together and they'll get away unscathed", the non-main characters are all so one note it hurts, you can't tell me much about Gregor except that he's just a cheery assassin with an accent, and that's all he is. same with just about every other character (inigo was pretty good tho but anyways) All the important story deaths (Aversa, Wallheart, Emmeryn ect) literally didn't matter since you get them all back in postgame for the sole purpose of marrying them. The story aspect of FE:A completely succumbs to the support system so much so that there isn't much of a point to even playing the game when the support conversations are uploaded on Youtube.

I say ALL of that to say that Fates is going to me more of the same, but even worse because now they have the niche market who doesn't care about the quality of the game, as long as they get their waifus. More forgettable story, more bland characters who exist for the sole purpose of you trying to date them, and more pandering and face petting. Like, in Corrin's trailer, you had the loli-type character going "Big Brother!!" over and over. You can instantly tell what her entire character is going to be just from a simple voice over, and the thing is, that's going to be the case with just about every character in Fates.

Awakening and Fates are bad games that sell because of mass pandering and otaku blood money, they're now in the same league as games like Hyperdimensial Neptunia and Senran. Corrin represents all of this and that's why Corrin is an awful choice and why I can't find any reason to be excited for him, cool moveset or not.

What this all amounts to is that you didn't like the series and don't feel FE characters should be added because of that. That's perfectly fine, just say you don't like the series. I don't believe that is grounds for saying a character shouldn't be in Smash though. I personally don't like the Game & Watch games, but acknowledge their significance to Nintendo's history and feel Mr. Game & Watch is a good character. I wasn't sold on Cpt. Olimar as a Smash character, but including him hasn't done anything to make the game less fun. Earthbound hasn't seen a release since the SNES afaik, yet it gets quite a bit of representation. So what?

I don't understand why so many people feel entitled to a game that only has what they want and nothing else. Nintendo isn't obligated to tailor a game to each buyer. They are the developers. They are the ones putting up money and investing time and effort into these projects. As the content creators, they have the prerogative to add or remove any characters they see fit. If you are that upset with their creative decisions, take up modding and add whatever content to the game you want. Light a candle instead of cursing the darkness.

People weren't happy with how Brawl turned out. Some people simply kvetched and complained. Others decided to do something about it. That's how we got Project M and countless stage and fighter mods. In the end, the only person who can make a game that suits you is you. There's a wealth of information and resources out there for people looking to mod games. I'd recommend you guys go through some of it and start tweaking games to fit your particular tastes. This way, your enjoyment of a game doesn't rely entirely on Nintendo adding a character you want or omitting one you don't like.

 

[PrinceOfKoopas]

What this all amounts to is that you didn't like the series and don't feel FE characters should be added because of that. That's perfectly fine, just say you don't like the series.

We do like the vast majority of the series.

That's like saying we don't like the PM series because we bash Sticker Star. If Kersti became a playable character in Smash 4 and we objected (too many plumber-series characters and from a really bad game, along with having no character), it's not because we dislike the greater series.

 

[BlackZero]

We do like the vast majority of the series.

That's like saying we don't like the PM series because we bash Sticker Star. If Kersti became a playable character in Smash 4 and we objected (too many plumber-series characters and from a really bad game, along with having no character), it's not because we dislike the greater series.

That's an awful lot of butthurt over adding FE characters to Smash for long time fans. I would think fans would be happy for the series to receive the attention it deserves (imo, but ymmv). Personally, I was thrilled to see the Famicom Wars AT, because that meant there was a chance that people would become interested in the Advance Wars series again. I'd rather games I love get representation in Smash than not. It shows me that they are still relevant, but that's just me. I suppose you'd be equally incensed if they added Sigurd, Nephenee, or Tana? Don't say it's because they aren't all sword users: they would be the same class of fighter. Were you upset by the Black Knight Mii outfit? I don't recall seeing the same level of outrage over that, either. I also don't recall hearing this much anti-FE rage until after Corrin was announced. Coincidentally, that was right about the same time the fans learned their favored character didn't make the cut. The plot thickens...

You also keep saying there are too many sword users in Smash. I'm afraid that argument doesn't hold water for two reasons. First, the number of sword users is dramatically less than both "shooter" and "brawler" character types. Second, Smash is a collection of different Nintendo series and characters from those series. I'm not sure if you're aware of this, but swords are a pretty big deal in Japan (and most of the world) and a lot of games use them as a hero's trademark. If we put an arbitrary limit on the number of sword users in a game that features a collection of Nintendo's stars, a lot of potentially deserving games and characters are going to get screwed. There is no such thing as "too many sword users" in Smash, because the roster reflects popular franchises. I would rather they leave the "sword limit" open and add characters they think deserve a slot than introduce some kind of quota system where they have to maintain a certain ratio of shooter/brawler/sword characters.

Really, the whole too many swords complaint smacks of either "doesn't like Fire Emblem" or "Unpleasable Fan." To quote this Reddit thread:

38 isn't the complete roster though. The leaked roster had 49 characters, and there may very likely be more to come.

Lets just be on the low side and round that 49 to a nice 50 (not even counting the Mii Fighters as 3 seprate characters). 8/50 means 16% of the roster uses swords. If we compare that to Melee where we can round the 26 to 25 so 4/25 means that 16% of the roster uses swords too. Now if we consider the Miis as 3 characters, and add the 4 speculated newcomers, Smash 4 ends up with a 8/54 which is ~14.8% while Melee ends up with a 4/26 or ~15.4% meaning that Smash 4 actually has a smaller percentage of sword users compared to Melee.

Thus, the percentage of sword users has remained proportionally consistent throughout the series. Now then, can we get off this "too many swords" horse? It's been ridden into the ground.

 

[DarkGold777]

That's an awful lot of butthurt over adding FE characters to Smash for long time fans. I would think fans would be happy for the series to receive the attention it deserves (imo, but ymmv). Personally, I was thrilled to see the Famicom Wars AT, because that meant there was a chance that people would become interested in the Advance Wars series again. I'd rather games I love get representation in Smash than not. It shows me that they are still relevant, but that's just me. I suppose you'd be equally incensed if they added Sigurd, Nephenee, or Tana? Don't say it's because they aren't all sword users: they would be the same class of fighter. Were you upset by the Black Knight Mii outfit? I don't recall seeing the same level of outrage over that, either. I also don't recall hearing this much anti-FE rage until after Corrin was announced. Coincidentally, that was right about the same time the fans learned their favored character didn't make the cut. The plot thickens...

You also keep saying there are too many sword users in Smash. I'm afraid that argument doesn't hold water for two reasons. First, the number of sword users is dramatically less than both "shooter" and "brawler" character types. Second, Smash is a collection of different Nintendo series and characters from those series. I'm not sure if you're aware of this, but swords are a pretty big deal in Japan (and most of the world) and a lot of games use them as a hero's trademark. If we put an arbitrary limit on the number of sword users in a game that features a collection of Nintendo's stars, a lot of potentially deserving games and characters are going to get screwed. There is no such thing as "too many sword users" in Smash, because the roster reflects popular franchises. I would rather they leave the "sword limit" open and add characters they think deserve a slot than introduce some kind of quota system where they have to maintain a certain ratio of shooter/brawler/sword characters.

Really, the whole too many swords complaint smacks of either "doesn't like Fire Emblem" or "Unpleasable Fan." To quote this Reddit thread:



Thus, the percentage of sword users has remained proportionally consistent throughout the series. Now then, can we get off this "too many swords" horse? It's been ridden into the ground.

THANK YOU.

I'm also sick of this anti-Corrin attitude for reasons including "too much FE", which needs more of an explanation as to why a franchise getting so much representation is "bad", "too many swords", an ironic argument considering Corrin's dragon transformation powers (a new thing for a Smash character, even if dragon people have been a longtime thing for the FE series) and the number of physical fighters and gun-users, and "the new FE sucks, FE is dead", an opinion that is not fact nor unanimously agreed upon by FE fans.